Just-Clayton
Senior Member
I get the whole gist of this! Now, since I have a 300sDX with a 35mm and a 610FX with a 50mm can I submit 6 photos??? LOL!!!
Nifty Fifty Assignment Lens Discussion
- Thread starter Bob Blaylock
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Bob Blaylock
Senior Member
Then why allow cropping? Cropping changes the field of view, to that which would have been obtained using a longer lens?
If it was really about the field of view, as you claim, then you wouldn't allow a picture taken with a lens of the specified length to be cropped, as that would alter the field of view; and you would allow me to submit a picture taken with my 28mm, if I cropped it so that it had the same field of view as a 50mm lens on an FX.
Having to operate under rules that are this stupidly arbitrary and pointless is never fun.
Re: July 2014 Monthly Assignment - Nifty Fifty(ish)!!
Come on guys, ease up.
The whole point of the exercise is to go out and shoot with the lens "fixed" at a certain focal length instead of zooming to frame or to create an effect, you just move around to find the best spot to produce your image.
We could discuss it all month without taking one single image...
Just get out of your comfort zone, tape your zoom to 50 if you have FX or 35 for DX and find a good subject and do some photography.
Enough complaining, go out, shoot, post and you might even like it enough to buy that lens...
Come on guys, ease up.
The whole point of the exercise is to go out and shoot with the lens "fixed" at a certain focal length instead of zooming to frame or to create an effect, you just move around to find the best spot to produce your image.
We could discuss it all month without taking one single image...
Just get out of your comfort zone, tape your zoom to 50 if you have FX or 35 for DX and find a good subject and do some photography.
Enough complaining, go out, shoot, post and you might even like it enough to buy that lens...
Michael J.
Senior Member
This should be posted here: http://nikonites.com/monthly-assign...assignment-nifty-fifty-ish.html#axzz37DNvKVN2
Yeah, but the background of the two images would be different because of the distance from the lens to the central focus point.
LOL. Come on. lighten up.
I don't think the rules are arbitrary at all. They may be a bit restrictive, but not arbitrary.
I had to use a zoom set as close to 35mm as I could. I would have rather used my 50mm f/1.8 for this, because it's a really sharp lens compared to any of my zooms. I have a DX camera, though. You know what? It was still a fun challenge and I do think it did stretch me, which was the point of this whole thing.
john*thomas
Senior Member
I'm just causing trouble because I'm working midnights and that makes me grouchy. On a zoom the equivalent to a 50mm FX wouldn't be 35mm as has been pointed out. 32mm would be closer.
Bob Blaylock
Senior Member
I'm not sure that it's exactly consistent from one DX model to another, but going off of the specifications listed in the manual for my D3200, as to the size of the sensor, I have up with a crop factor of 1.553781777… compared to a standard 35mm film frame—enough to make a difference. Using the widely-cited, but incorrect crop factor of 1.5, you actually get 33⅓mm as the “50mm equivalent” for a DX camera. Using the crop factor which I calculated, and then rounding that result to two digits past the point, I get 32.18mm. I've generally taken to using 1.55 as the crop factor in making such calculations, and I see here that this gives me 32.25mm.
It seems to me that an important point is that anyone who is using anything other than a 35mm film camera, or an FX-format camera, simply is not going to get an exact equivalent to a 50mm lens. Nobody makes a 32mm or a 33mm lens, as far as I know, and you're not going to get a zoom lens to stay at exactly that setting.
Requiring an exact “50mm equivalent” lens effectively disqualifies anyone who isn't using a 35mm film or FX-format digital camera, unless you allow a certain reasonable amount of variance from the exact “50mm equivalent”. And if you're going to allow any such variance, then it doesn't make sense for that variance to be anything other than to allow anything that is within the range considered a “normal lens” for the format you're using, which would be anything from the equivalent of 40mm through 58mm on a 35mm camera, or about 25.74mm through 37.33mm on my D3200.
The 28mm prime that I wanted to use, when mounted on my D3200, is equivalent to a 43½mm lens on a 35mm camera, so it would fall within this range.
This is the best argument so far against this months rules. I just wish I thought of it.
Now I'm going out , taping my 18-55 to a 35mm focal length and going to submit the same photo 3 times cropped 3 different ways...LOL.:excitement:
The smartass in me was toying with the idea of getting my 18-55 zoomed as close as I could to the specified range, and taking a picture from a considerable distance of my intended subject, so that I'd have to crop the image in very tight to get a reasonable view of the subject; having complied with the foolish requirement for an exact focal length, but having the equivalent field of view of a much, much longer lens. This would technically comply with the stated rules, but would be very obvious about flouting the stated intent of the rules.
Of course, if I did this, I would be doing it to mock these rules and the one who devised them; rather than to participate positively in the challenge. As well-deserved as I think this mockery would be, I think it better to leave the challenge for those who wish to participate, and not ruin it for them. Hopefully, next month's challenge will have been better thought out.
Re: July 2014 Monthly Assignment - Nifty Fifty(ish)!!
Kudos to those who have embraced this month's challenge in the spirit in which it was intended. I applaud your willingness to jump in and give it a shot. :applause:
We had a power outage here last week--lost power twice, knocked down LOADS of tree limbs in the area which took power lines with them, plus it blew a transformer so I haven't yet attempted anything (I'm a caregiver so my camera wasn't my priority). Since I don't own a 50mm prime, I will simply zoom and get as close as possible to 50mm. It doesn't sound like I need to be a rocket scientist to figure out how to zoom. :eagerness: <zoom zoom> See, I CAN do it!
I like this type of challenge to make us aware of how a normal lens works...telephoto lenses compress and wide angles...well...they yield an image that looks something like what I see in the passenger side mirror of a car. I even think my car's passenger mirror states, Objects in mirror are closer than they appear. Wide angle lenses tend to elongate objects front to back compared to a tele's compression.
I need to put some thought into this one....
Kudos to those who have embraced this month's challenge in the spirit in which it was intended. I applaud your willingness to jump in and give it a shot. :applause:
We had a power outage here last week--lost power twice, knocked down LOADS of tree limbs in the area which took power lines with them, plus it blew a transformer so I haven't yet attempted anything (I'm a caregiver so my camera wasn't my priority). Since I don't own a 50mm prime, I will simply zoom and get as close as possible to 50mm.
It doesn't sound like I need to be a rocket scientist to figure out how to zoom. :eagerness: <zoom zoom> See, I CAN do it! I like this type of challenge to make us aware of how a normal lens works...telephoto lenses compress and wide angles...well...they yield an image that looks something like what I see in the passenger side mirror of a car. I even think my car's passenger mirror states, Objects in mirror are closer than they appear. Wide angle lenses tend to elongate objects front to back compared to a tele's compression.
I need to put some thought into this one....
Why would anyone here deserve mockery Bob? Because they don't agree with you and you don't like the guidelines of a casual assignment?
I also don't see how you participating would ruin anything for anyone.
What's your beef? If you want to break the rules or think they are silly, you can always get rid of your exif and post whatever you want. But you will have missed the whole point of the Assignment.
No need to get anal about this.
Forgive me, I am not a participant, so of course, it's none of my business. But I have to think it would have gone better if this assignment had been presented as using a "normal lens" (which is the same thing as this one asked, and assumed, without those words. This was an important concept in the days before zoom lenses. Cameras (35mm film) without interchangeable lenses came with a 50mm lens. because it was the "normal" lens, the one most often useful - the one with the angular view considered to match our eyes view. There generally were no kit lenses then, but it would have been 50mm. 50mm was still an important choice if you had a few lenses, it offered the "normal view", where wide angle and telephoto were more special purpose. It definitely was a major concept. Sometimes it taught "zooming with your feet". (DX 35mm equivalent lens today)
Any assignment/contest ought to be about the picture of course, it should not specify one has to wear a yellow shirt, or only use a tripod. But it seems to me, using the normal lens qualifies as a photographic principle. It just was not said that way this time. I think it assumed everyone would automatically know.
Any assignment/contest ought to be about the picture of course, it should not specify one has to wear a yellow shirt, or only use a tripod. But it seems to me, using the normal lens qualifies as a photographic principle. It just was not said that way this time. I think it assumed everyone would automatically know.
Bob Blaylock
Senior Member
This is where my quibble comes in.
A “Normal lens” isn't defined as 50mm on a 35mm camera. It's defined as a lens that gives roughly the same angle of view as a human eye, which is achieved by having a focal length that is approximately equal to the diagonal measurement of the frame.
A standard 35mm film frame has a diagonal measurement of 43.27 millimeters, so the truest “normal lens” would have a focal length close to that. 50mm is a length that was arbitrarily chosen by Oskar Barnack, who is the one who created the first Leica camera. He picked this length, and it's come to be accepted as a standard. It's actually a bit on the long side for its intended purpose, but close enough. I guess Herr Barnack cared more, at that point, about a nice, neat number than having exactly the right angle of view.
The 35mm length, specified in the challenge as the “correct” length to use on a DX camera isn't really a “50mm equivalent”; on a D3200, at least, it would be equivalent to a 54.38mm lens on a 35mm camera; even farther from the truest correct “normal lens” focal length for this sensor size.
According to the specifications for my D3200, the sensor is 23.2mm ×15.4mm. The diagonal of that is 27.846…mm; so my 28mm lens ought to be a more acceptable lens to use for this challenge than any that have been stated as acceptable.
Bob, with due respect to your knowledge and concerns, the 35mm DX prime is the closest to the 50mm FX view, so kind of makes sense to go with that focal length for the DXers on the chance there is someone who has the prime and no zoom. Note also that the title of the assignment tags the focal length as an "ish" and there have been some slight variation from 35mm with no rejections.
I haven't had any trouble getting my 18-55 on 35, but I can see where it might be hard to hold on some lenses. Just means you sweat more than a few others.
You jumped on this with all four feet before we had it all figured out, so gear up and jump back in. I wanna see what you can do under adverse conditions.
I haven't had any trouble getting my 18-55 on 35, but I can see where it might be hard to hold on some lenses. Just means you sweat more than a few others.
You jumped on this with all four feet before we had it all figured out, so gear up and jump back in. I wanna see what you can do under adverse conditions.
OK
Right, 50 is the number, and always has been.
Normal has always been rounded off. 43mm diagonal to a 50 mm lens. 35mm film simply always used 50 mm lenses (maybe +/- 5mm, sometimes, but vast majority were 50). If anything is common knowledge, it's that. Maybe you had to be there.
There's lots of DX sensors. APS C film size (the size model) was 25.1 x 16.7mm (30mm diagonal). And DX (a generic 24x16mm) is 29mm, rounded off is 35mm. And 35mm x 1.5 crop factor is 52.5mm, or about 50 mm, rounding off. Equivalent for DX.
The assignment specified 35mm, but I would doubt anyone is going to quibble about 28mm if that's what you've got.
For this challenge only: All images must be taken with a 50mm FX or equivalent lens (CX: 18.5mm - DX: 35mm) OR an equal focal length with a zoom.
So no, 28mm does not meet the criteria for the assignment.
Guys, what is the problem? You are beating a dead horse. If you don't like the assignment, don't participate.
Horoscope Fish
Senior Member
Bob Blaylock
Senior Member
35mm on a DX is not the equivalent of 50mm on an FX.
“Close enough”, perhaps, but if you're going to allow “close enough”, then there's no reason why you shouldn't allow 28mm on a DX.
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