Need a camera and fully confused

[sampochin]

Thanks biker that would be really helpful. My brother does photography professionally, so he should be able to help me quite a bit. Only problem that book doesn't ship to U.K., I'll try and find something similar here. I'd like to learn for myself and not keep asking him everything.


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[sampochin]

D750 is decided. Found one for £1100 and another for around £1400. In gonna go and see them in the flesh to decide which one to get. Probably better to buy new. Anyway for lens I'm thinking of getting the 105mm Nikon micro lens. Is there much difference between different brands? When I had a telescope I always bought branded lenses because they weren't a lot more than unbranded but these slr lenses are expensive! Will there be A lot of difference between a£300 and £1000 lens? I'm guessing there must be some difference in the quality of the optics but enough to merit the extra expense?


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[jay_dean]

Just to throw a late entry into the mix, if the D810 was desired but too expensive a second hand D800 can be picked up for well under £1000. Nearly as good as the D810

 

[sampochin]

Wow a quick read on Ken rockwells site suggests it's a really good piece of kit.


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[jay_dean]

Wow a quick read on Ken rockwells site suggests it's a really good piece of kit.


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Just a word of advice about KR's website, look elsewhere for true impartial assessments. It is a great camera though

 

[sampochin]

Just a word of advice about KR's website, look elsewhere for true impartial assessments. It is a great camera though

Yes off course, I'd rather listen to someone who uses it for the same thing I'm intending to use it for. If I can't then get as many impartial opinions as possible.


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[spb_stan]

Stop! Don't buy anything until you figure out your studio and lighting. Cameras will not differ enough to compensate of less than optimum lighting. Seriously, cameras just hold a sensor and record light data, any camera will be good enough but your lighting and skill using it, posing and composition determine whether the images is good enough for the catalog. For your $2000, spend most of it on 3 strobes, stands, backdrops, modifiers(stripboxes, softbox, gobos, snoots, grids and guess what, you used up the $2000 but you get far more bang for your dollar with that lighting set up than spending it on a camera. Then borrow any modern DSLR and you are ready to start learning how to do it and how to pose.
You are running off in the wrong direction and even a D810 without good lighting will be no better than your cell phone. If you are going to shoot them yourself, attend workshops, volunteer to assist in a working fashion studio, or pay them to allow you to hang out.
Posing/professional skilled models, lighting, photographer skill, post processing and very last is the camera and lens in order of priority. There is no arguing with this, ask any successful clothing line how they present their products. A camera will not even be mentioned.

 

[sampochin]

I agree with you, I'm just excited about getting the camera because I always loved taking photos! Because I'm new to doing it myself I thought it best to ask people that know. I have started next to learn a little about lens to narrow it down and then order. Next I will go onto lighting.
But really it sounds like a need to buy you a bottle of single malt and get a list of what I need. A list that stays within a reasonable budget!


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[spb_stan]

Lenses are important of course but with lighting and a backdrop, fashion is not quite like portraiture where fast lenses wide open are used to blur the background to isolate the subject. In fashion you want everything in perfect focus which means stopped down. Almost any lens, at f/8 is pretty darn sharp. You want the whole person in focus so many lenses,including low cost kit lenses with good light will do a great job but would not have done as well on portraits. Study the general topic of light and photography and watch lots of Youtube instructional videos on posing and studio lighting.
You are going to need enough space to shoot from a little distance in the room but not so much distance to overshoot your backdrop. For catalog work, detail and lack of detail robbing shadows are desired but enough shadows to show texture and contours. A $300 used D7000 with a 50mm lens would be fine for anything less than glossy fashion magazines. How much space how high the ceiling? Spend the weekend watching fashion photo shoots on YouTube then come back with your questions for specific answers.

 

[Vincent]

... I'm just excited about getting the camera ...

That is the trap we all fall into.
I did once post about this: https://petapixel.com/2016/08/24/new-old-vintage-nikons-worst-best-zoom-lenses-compared/

However I have not been cured myself, some people stated I should not save as much money as I do, so I did spent a lot on photography the last months.

To answer some questions:
Not yet able to say how much a D800 would help compared to D750. I have not worked with them.
These are both still top performers. The advantage of D800 is to use some details of your shots as final result, faster way to work then the D750, but probably not that much either.

105 Micro is a good lens, other brand Macro lenses (Tokina, Sigma, Tamron, Zeiss) are excellent as well.
Nikon lenses will be more compatible for the future, have better Auto Focus, ... however they might not be the best choice for you.

I do believe you need a wider lens as well, with a 105 you will need a lot of distance between you and your subject. So if you shoot in a hanger, OK. In a room, probably not.

a 300 vs 1000 EUR lens

=> honestly I find this very difficult to grasp and see very little good information.
1) quality is relative, technical testing has its limits, ledgends persist, ...
2) I tend to use myself:
- DXO mark lens tests: effective megapixels with that lens on the D800E
- Lenscore: I mainly look at the resolving power
- Photozone.de reviews

All this misses in general what people call 3D effect, contrast, colour character, etc... which I fear only your own experience will teach.

Conclusion:
- most of us are as confused as you, there is nothing wrong with that, it is part of the photography experience.
- most of us also put too much attention to camera and lenses and not enough on the way you get effects with light and set up
- some of us are very clear on what is needed, and completely wrong in their beliefs

P.S.: there is so much on the market since it is all useful

 

[JH Foto]

Don't waste your money buy a good bridge camera that's all you will need for your purpose.

 

[sampochin]

I think what I'll do is buy the d750 body and start hiring a few lenses to do practice shoots, if the pictures are usable then great. If I hire probably two maybe 3 I might slowly start getting an idea of what lenses to buy


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[spb_stan]

If you are limited in funds, as most of us are, you are putting way too much of that money into things will not increase sales in the catalog.

A good backdrop for consistent color background so the images fit the web catalog(white is good since a white background web site will allow photos to pop and match the art work.

A few lights and stands

A infinite horizon floor for the model's scene floor...make this yourself matching the color of the backdrop

Line up a good model or two, 1 at first, one who is not only very experienced but will help teach you how to work with models. She will want to be hired regularly so wants you to be informed and successful. If she thinks you are a long time associate, she should be eager to help. Don't look just for pretty faces, it is more important for a skilled model, no amateurs until you are very effective in posing, that may come later. The model will be the most important sales tool, to make the clothing appear in its best possible presentation. Good models are rare,many girls want to be models without knowing the skills that separate the amateurs from the ones that sell products.

Volunteer to sweep floors or be a gofer for a pro studio, for free just to see the workflow.
Learn basic post processing with Adobe Lightroom and Photoshop bundle for $9.99 a month...great investment.

Get a used decent camera, anything 12mpx or higher. DR is not so important for catalog shoots with good light...literally any camera made from the D90 to present.
Your lens will probably be a mid-zoom, as long as it covers 24-50mm if in a small space, 24-70 if a larger space. You are going to be shooting at f/5.6-8 anyway so an expensive fast lens is not needed, not for web based catalogs

If you want to experiment with full frame, rent it for test sessions.
This is about the only way to make your $2000, you mentioned earlier, stretch to the point of seeing a return on investment.

The order of priorities
Reliable simple lighting set up
PRO model to start, you are wasting all the money if, as a beginner, you start with amateur or beginning models. First start with one who can teach you
Good simple set, if you want fancy resist that temptation, anything in the scene will detract from the clothes. Props also simple, a flower or a balloon with a pro model can be very effective.

Decent monitor you can calibrate the color
Decent reliable computer with backup drive...does not have to be latest models
Practice with Lightroom and Photoshop
Last on the list is camera and lens


If your were doing glossy magazine covers, by all means use good equipment like medium format or at least great lenses and a D800, 810 but you are not and you are going to be ready that for another decade. But with the setup above, ,you can have a very competent profitable catalog that people enjoy shopping in.
Go to catalogs that you buy from, ask friends who buy clothes on-line for which sites and look at them carefully, what are the size and resolution of the images, what format in cropping and which style theme are they using( a catalog theme is simple a design standard for images,color background, brightness, aspect ratio, etc so images are consistent between pages) You do not need to copy the other sites, but it will give you an idea of what needs to be consistent frame to frame.

That is how you should allocate your funds.
Good luck

 

[theregsy]

We are a retailer of clothes in Birmingham UK. We sell Asian partywear and bridal. Mostly from the shop but we also have a website which will need nice pictures adding to regular. So I need a camera to do stills only (video function will only be used with kids when on holiday). My budget is up to £2000. But if I can get away with much less it would be better. I was first thinking canon 1dx because of a video I saw on YT. Now I'm thinking d750. My brother used to have a d3 is that still a good one to get or is it discontinued now? I'm going for a second hand one as 'cex' give a 2 year warranty with everything they sell. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks


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I would go for a used D700, its the same sensor as a D3 and you can get one used for well under £1000 pounds (about £600-700) buy a Sigma 24-70mm f2.8 lens and you are on to a winner, it has no video but it is a great camera, if you really want video go for the D800 which is still a great camera. With the full frame sensor and a reasonably bright (fast ) lens you should be able to shoot in most lighting without a flash.

 

[sampochin]

I would go for a used D700, its the same sensor as a D3 and you can get one used for well under £1000 pounds (about £600-700) buy a Sigma 24-70mm f2.8 lens and you are on to a winner, it has no video but it is a great camera, if you really want video go for the D800 which is still a great camera. With the full frame sensor and a reasonably bright (fast ) lens you should be able to shoot in most lighting without a flash.

That's interesting I'll check that out, thanks for that.


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[spb_stan]

The D700 was a good camera but the features suggested are not the features you need. ALL newer Nikons have higher resolution sensors, have replacement parts available, and are easier to repair if needed. The suggestion you did not need flash for fashion seems strange.,...you need the full article of clothing in focus and well lit, which means augmented light and stopped down apertures, just the opposite of what he suggested as buying criteria. The D700 is a well made camera but is 12mpx and every camera in the Nikon since the D7000 has at least 16mpx resolution, all the cameras expect for the dedicated sports cameras (D4, D5) have at least 24mpx resolution since 5-6 years ago, even the entry level D3300.
Shooting models with enough depth of field for a catalog means added lighting even in sunny outdoor scenes....especially outdoor scenes.
You have some specific needs for catalog use that are fulfilled by a wide range of cameras and a lot of features separating the beginner from the advanced enthusiast cameras that are not really important in what you will be shooting. You do not need super fast tracking auto focusing, and you do not need very high sensitivity in low light, and you do not need fast frame rates so those are primarily benefits of higher end cameras that cost more and are more complex. What you need is satisfied by every modern Nikon made: Good resolution and good color accuracy in good light.

 

[jay_dean]

The D700 was a good camera

The D700 is a good camera, a very good one. Don't write it off because of its old tech and lower than newer Nikon MP resolution. This camera produces fantastic images and the OP would do well to look into this option. Images produced for catalogues or the internet will be as good as any new Nikon body. If the OP wants to take up wildlife or sports then yeah, maybe look elsewhere

 

[spb_stan]

But why spend so much on features that have no benefit to the intended use? Yes, good general purpose camera but expensive to repair or not repairable at all now, without warranty, and low resolution, less than most phone cameras nowadays. He has a specific subject and goal, and an old D700 does not address those any better than other less expensive, repairable cameras. low ISO


At low ISO, 100 as used in the studio the D700 was not great, in dynamic range. Compared to other cameras at the time it was very good. But it is a full 1.5 stops worse in PDR than a DX D7000 and 2.5 stops less PDR than a D7200. A D7000 has higher resolution and costs about $300...so lower noise, wider color depth, much cheaper lenses for a newer D7000 or about the same price as a clearly IQ superior D7200 that can use lower cost DX lenses, I fail to see what advantage the OP receives from an older camera that is out of warranty, lower res, lower DR, with lower res view finder, that required more expensive lenses.
If sticking with Full Frame, a D600 which can be had for a lot less has 2.5 stops more 100 ISO PDR A D600 is going for about $550 now, with 24mpx, more color fidelity, twice the resolution, better low light performance so it makes little sense for a $1200 D700 when he said he had $2000 to work with and needs lights, stands, backdrop, cards, lens. Lights and modifiers, wireless flash controllers stands are essential and eat up almost 1/2 the budget. This is a task defined goal, not which is the most beloved camera. The D700 is nice camera in the hand for general photography but not a great choice for the budget that also has lighting and lens purchases to make. Even a D90 at ISO 100, has a 1/4 stop more PDR than a D700 and and if the D700 is shooting in Dx mode to use less expensive lenses like the D90 uses, it is a little over 1/2 stop disadvantage. Sure the D700 was head and shoulders better than the competing Canon and Pentax of the day but not so competitive with the rest of Nikon consumer cameras by the time the D700 went out of production.

Here is a graph of PDR for various models that used, are a lot cheaper than the D700. I included the D700 in DX mode also since there is a good chance the OP will be using low cost but good DX lenses:

At 100 ISO, the ISO expected to be used in the studio, the D700 really does not perform up to the level of much less expensive cameras. Sensor technology and image processors have advanced a lot.

 

[jay_dean]

Having owned two D700 bodies i know that these produce great images in real world shooting and the prices of these are (relatively)very cheap, about the same as a D600 and D7100. I wouldn't write off any bodies, I've seen great studio images taken with a D200 and i dont think the OP would be disappointed with any of the suggestions if used correctly with a good quality lens and adequate lighting

 

[aroy]

You do not need an esoteric system or camera to do product shots for the Web. A basic DSLR and good sharp lenses augmented with lights and reflectors will give you excellent results.

What I would suggest is a two pronged strategy

1. Use a good cell phone camera and shoot in good light - Investment = ZERO.

2. Get a D3300 with 18-55 kit lens and shoot the same scenes with it. Shoot RAW to get the benefit of the dynamic range and use Nikon Capture NX-D to process the images. This will enable you to have a latitude in lighting as you can recover deep shadows and tone down highlights with RAW - investment ~ $500.

After a week compare the shots. For all you know the cell phone ones will be as good as the D3300. If you are going to shoot mostly in a Studio environment, then after you get used to the DSLR invest in
. Sturdy studio grade Tripod and a Ball head, say a Manfroto.
. A range of backdrops of various colours.
. A set of good flash and/or strobes.

The beauty of the D3300 is that it is an excellent 24MP camera and for product shots as good or as bad as the other 24MP cameras. It is priced so low that most of the good lenses are more expensive than the body with a kit lens, so if you do not like it, you can sell it off and loose the equivalent of a dinner for a family of four in a decent restaurant.

In the last three years I have shot more than 80,000 images with my D3300, the kit 18-55 and the 35mm f1.8DX. All the systems are still going strong and should last another 50,000 shutter actuation.