We will have to just disagree that there is NO blur. Far better than Sony, but they do blur.
Why so little interest here on the forum in the Z6/7?
- Thread starter spb_stan
- Start date
We will have to just disagree that there is NO blur. Far better than Sony, but they do blur.
A lot of active users of both DSLR and Z6/7 would disagree with them adding no advances over DSLR. For those who have both, most have switched to use the Z camera more. I know I ended up with a D850 and D800 gathering dust on the shelf since the Z6 became my daily shooter.
After the 2.0 firmware update, AF tracking is as good or better than the D850 in good light and much better in poor light. For tripod shots the D850 can focus about as accurately as the Z cameras in good light but using the mirror, no DSLR can be expected to be as accurate. AF down to -6ev is pretty darn good and certainly better than a D850.
The Z camera can use the optically excellent S lenses. Even the kit 24-70 f/4 is significantly better than the G or E 24-70 2.8 F mount.
The Z cameras have better connectivity
Better video in all formats
The z6 has lower noise at high ISO
Its faster in Frame rate and tracks better now frame to frame
It has excellent IBIS...so all lens even old AIS MF lenses are a breeze to focus and are stabilized. My 50 1.2 AIS bought new 6 years ago(they still make it built of the same materials and construction as the classic old glass) has become very usable now, as an example, of the accuracy of the Focus Peaking function.
The EVF is excellent and far easier to use in low light than any DSLR, with all the shooting info in the EVF that is bright and sharp. None are sharper because of the complex len configuration used in the Z cameras.
It has a lot of features not available on DSLRs such as a true silent mode.
All in a small light very solidly built rugged weather sealed body with better shock resistance than DSLR
Users report that they have more keepers since the exposure and framing in the EVF is exactly like the finished image so no chimping or bracketing exposure to make sure it was captured as intended. Taking fewer frames but having more keepers is the usually response.
if you talk to Z camera users. Their light weight and small size means they can be taken everywhere and not attract attention so travel, backpacking, street, long shoots like weddings or long events, and quiet operation means they can be used in theaters and performances where the DSLR is too loud. Hiking 8 hours with a Z camera compared to a gripped D850 and its heavier F lenses means that it is taken less often. For me, traveling by regional airlines, it means being able to take a good camera.I bought mine right after a 3 week winter trip to Turkey where I was not permitted to take the D850 and lens because even a smaller bag exceeded the weight and size limits for in-cabin stowage. I had to take a 18-105 slow lens and my smallest body, a d7000. Hiking in deep snow for 6-8 hours a day in the central mountains made me happy I did not bring the heavy glass or gripped d850 or 800
That was the 3rd flight in a year where the D850 was not possible to take. At first I got the Z7 but traded it back to the store as soon as the Z6 became available. Now after selling the D850 I will add a Z7 again for clients who insist on larger files. Or the rumored Z8/9 model later this year. The only feature a pro-version might have to offer is a deeper buffer which is not something I need.
Nikon really put a lot of thought into their entry into the mirrorless field. I had tried the Sony but it was horrible to hold, or use the menu but most of all, I hated how it was built as a throwaway camera. The Nikon is far better.
After the 2.0 firmware update, AF tracking is as good or better than the D850 in good light and much better in poor light. For tripod shots the D850 can focus about as accurately as the Z cameras in good light but using the mirror, no DSLR can be expected to be as accurate. AF down to -6ev is pretty darn good and certainly better than a D850.
The Z camera can use the optically excellent S lenses. Even the kit 24-70 f/4 is significantly better than the G or E 24-70 2.8 F mount.
The Z cameras have better connectivity
Better video in all formats
The z6 has lower noise at high ISO
Its faster in Frame rate and tracks better now frame to frame
It has excellent IBIS...so all lens even old AIS MF lenses are a breeze to focus and are stabilized. My 50 1.2 AIS bought new 6 years ago(they still make it built of the same materials and construction as the classic old glass) has become very usable now, as an example, of the accuracy of the Focus Peaking function.
The EVF is excellent and far easier to use in low light than any DSLR, with all the shooting info in the EVF that is bright and sharp. None are sharper because of the complex len configuration used in the Z cameras.
It has a lot of features not available on DSLRs such as a true silent mode.
All in a small light very solidly built rugged weather sealed body with better shock resistance than DSLR
Users report that they have more keepers since the exposure and framing in the EVF is exactly like the finished image so no chimping or bracketing exposure to make sure it was captured as intended. Taking fewer frames but having more keepers is the usually response.
if you talk to Z camera users. Their light weight and small size means they can be taken everywhere and not attract attention so travel, backpacking, street, long shoots like weddings or long events, and quiet operation means they can be used in theaters and performances where the DSLR is too loud. Hiking 8 hours with a Z camera compared to a gripped D850 and its heavier F lenses means that it is taken less often. For me, traveling by regional airlines, it means being able to take a good camera.I bought mine right after a 3 week winter trip to Turkey where I was not permitted to take the D850 and lens
That was the 3rd flight in a year where the D850 was not possible to take. At first I got the Z7 but traded it back to the store as soon as the Z6 became available. Now after selling the D850 I will add a Z7 again for clients who insist on larger files. Or the rumored Z8/9 model later this year. The only feature a pro-version might have to offer is a deeper buffer which is not something I need.
Nikon really put a lot of thought into their entry into the mirrorless field. I had tried the Sony but it was horrible to hold, or use the menu but most of all, I hated how it was built as a throwaway camera. The Nikon is far better.
Danno
Senior Member
I wanted to make a comment on the part of your reply regarding the step backward. I can see where anyone can prefer the 850 over the Z bodies. That is simply a matter of personal preference. I would never argue over a persons choice. But I do disagree on the issue with regards to the Z systems being a step backward. Yes it is your opinion, and I will not argue that, but I do want to point out some advancements that you may not know about the Z6, and they do include the Z7
I can say without any reservation that, in my opinion, it is not a step backward, but a significant step forward in several areas.
I cannot speak to the 850 I have never owned one. But the Z6 that I own, once I got to know the focus systems, has not disappointed me. The low light high ISO has blown me away. The IBIS is amazing as well. I have tremors that affect my hand hold shots. I had to really work on technique to get steady shots with my D700 and D7200. Now with the Z6 I can go below a 1/10 of a second with Z glass and it is steadier than I could get with either of my DSLRs.
The low light and high ISO are amazing and from what I have read, comparable to the 850. The IBIS is just better than the VR that I have in the glass that I own, but the F mount lenses I use with the FTZ adapter work very well also.
The other big thing is the WYSIWYG in the electronic view finder and being able to confirm shots on sunny days in the EVF. It is good to confirm the exposure and be happy with the focus and for those moments when you just want to be certain you can hit the review button and hit the OK button and without removing your eye from the viewfinder confirm the sharpness of the focus.
I like nature shots like landscapes, flowers, and occasionally birds; it just depends on how I am doing. I like car shows and architecture as well. I also take a lot of photos for my church in challenging lighting conditions. I have been well pleased with the results, keep rate, and post processing.
I won't say the Z6 is a D500 or D850 I have owned neither. but for me it is an amazing camera and the cool thing is they continue to upgrade firmware to make it better. The last two have improved focus and low light both.
The main problem with the Z is its new, it threatens existing desires for pro DSLRs.
It does appear to have one major draw back for action if i am reading the spec correctly, only the center focus point uses PD-AF, Contrast detect while being spot on for still subjects (live view in a DSLR) is not easy for action shots.
The main reason i am not buying in is the weight will still be too much for me with a birding lens and full frame is not a lot of use to me, crop is better for me.
It does appear to have one major draw back for action if i am reading the spec correctly, only the center focus point uses PD-AF, Contrast detect while being spot on for still subjects (live view in a DSLR) is not easy for action shots.
The main reason i am not buying in is the weight will still be too much for me with a birding lens and full frame is not a lot of use to me, crop is better for me.
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Some what the same with my Olympus,just did a test the other day 25 shots of a duck flying towards me all caught.
Danno
Senior Member
Nikon has never been the best at conveying things clearly. The focus system is different than you describe Mike. It took the manual and a handbook for me to begin to understand the new system. But I think that there has been enough confusion that they finally talking more about it.
The system is a hybrid of Phase and Contrast detect in all modes. To quote Nikon, "an AF algorithm optimized for its FX-format sensor, Z 6 automatically switches between focal-plane phase-detect AF and contrast-detect AF to fine-tune focus. The light-shielding phase detection pixels are carefully arranged on the sensor to preserve light, ensuring accurate AF even in dim lighting." These algorithms have been enhanced in three Firmware updates improving the focus system, and it has improved. I can actually capture Jersey Girl running towards me with the Z6... I could not do that before with my other Nikons. I think a lot of my problem before was the weight of the gripped bodies. But the weight was not the only thing. I just never got confident with the other bodies like I have the Z6.
The one mode that is a bit different is "pinpoint" which is intended for stationary objects. Any of the 273 points on the sensor can be used for pin point focus, but it is slower and not intended for action shots. I believe this mode relies primarily on CD, but it is not specified in the manual. It only notes that is is slower and intended for high accuracy. I have not used it much. Single point has been fine for me.
The Z6 is lighter, but you are right, to get the reach like we have discussed, it is far heavier than your Olympus.
Thanks, i was a bit concerned if i had got it right, PD-AF is needed for action and when i thought it only had i spot in the center ::what::
Danno
Senior Member
Really it is, because the camera does all the work. The hard part is getting used to the AF Area Modes. These are the menu fields that determine camera selects the focus point and how it functions, because they are enough different from the Nikon DSLRs that you have to read the manual and get familiar with them.
You do not need to understand the Algorithm in the Z6 anymore than you need to know the one in the D850. They both use them to calculate focus. But you do need to know which methods are being used to make informed decisions about each camera. This Hybrid that Nikon has developed is new and uses PD and CD to fine tune the process of auto focus.
I do not know about you but as for me my engineering days are past me. All I am concerned about is that it works. If it doesn't work I want them to fix it... So far they have been making it better.
Lessons from whom? Compared to the competition Nikon logical, easy to navigate menus are often cited as the best in the industry and moving between camera is easy due to the consistent naming and order. Moving from a D90, my first digital Nikon in 11 years ago, to a D7000 to D800 adding a D850 and then adding the Z6 has meant no diving the manual. My manual was all in Russian so my basic 5th grade knowledge of the language did not get me far so I just went out shooting and have not opened the manual since. Within days of shooting the D850 and Z6, the Z became my #1 camera and has been with me. The interface it intuitive, and easy to use without taking my eye from the EVF. All the ket settings can be set while taking photos right in the EVF and chimping is not required to confirm exposure or focus. With a 100% coverage EVF it means close precise framing is done, as well as exposure and focus before the shutter is released. That is not a difficult or confusing interface at all, just the opposite.
I've had a D100, a D300, a D7000 and when I retired I bought myself a D850. Before my personal cameras we had several of the Kodaks and one odd Fuji or something, at work - an industrial photolab. While I am accostomed to Nikon's naming conventions in my opinion Cannon has the clearest most rational menu system. And I don't have a Canon. I've just had several opportunities to handle them. If I were starting over that's where I'd go.