Wedding last summer

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rocketman122

Senior Member
Flugelbinder said:
I've heard of way larger numbers of shots to deliver 100... A few days ago I asked my sister-in-law if I could have a look at her wedding album. I was appalled! There was even OUT OF FOCUS pictures..... So, WUD, you did a great job. :)
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they included OOF pictures? how pathetic. btw, giving more pictures doesnt compensate for crap pictures. its not the mindset that more means less quality. I held myself back from giving more because there were so many keepers. but giving so much lowers its worth. since this was family I spoiled them.
 
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Flugelbinder

Senior Member
rocketman122 said:
they included OOF pictures? how pathetic. btw, giving more pictures doesnt compensate for crap pictures. its not the mindset that more means less quality. I held myself back from giving more because there were so many keepers. but giving so much lowers its worth. since this was family I spoiled them.
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Yep. And I'm not talking about selective focus... The bride's face is out of focus...
 
wud

wud

Senior Member
Flugelbinder said:
You're not the first one to recommend this and I would love to. My question is: How do you do it? Just walk in ask? I don't know if a lot of them would see that in a good way...
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I only follow a few photographers on facebook, but one of them wrote a status, that he needed an assistant.
But yes, I would print out a bunch of my stuff and either call, write or visit them.
 
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rocketman122

Senior Member
Flugelbinder said:
rocketman122 said:
Another thing I will highly recommend is you should consider working for other photographers. QUOTE]

You're not the first one to recommend this and I would love to. My question is: How do you do it? Just walk in ask? I don't know if a lot of them would see that in a good way...
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its a catch 22. like when looking for work, they always want experience but how do you get experience if they dont hire you. you do buy building a work portfolio of anything youve photographed. if you shot birds if you shot landscape. show pictures of kids youve photographed. if you were at a carnival show that, fireworks, still life, whatever. but make nice big blow ups. buy a nice portfolio album and put it in that. even when going to wedding as a guest snipe a few pictures and add that. show youre versatile. show you have variety. show youre able to photograph different things. show creativity. do some nice black and white stuff. a wedding pro doesnt need to see wedding work they want to see creativity they want to see youre able to work under different condition. they want to see how you see things. I dont care if you photograph a computer or grass or an eclair or whatever. I want to see your skills I want to see your potential. most places dont really want to take someone is very experienced. they want someone they can "guide" they want someone who has a clean head and isnt infected with bad habits. they want a slave basically. it doesnt sound good but basically someone who they can mold. like a hi tech company taking new recruitment. they want to teach them their way.

How I started? my sister met some guy at a cafe (friend of a friend) just talking about something. not in a romantic way. they were talking about photography and she told him that I have passion and I really have potential. I was starting out learning flash. I was shooting tiny flowers and skittles. I printed those. and added it to my album. then there was this teen girl who asked if I would do some pics of her. I did and added that. I went to an ancient ruins site and took some pictures there and added that. I did some kodak high speed infrared film and got some pics and added that as well. did some pics of my ex wife and added that. I had a lot of different stuff I did. they were very impressed and they were looking for a newbie to mold. I had also built up my gear by that time and it was good enough to start. I joined the team to weddings. he told me M 1/60 5.6, flash on all the time hahaha and thats what I did. I was very strong technically wise. meaning, the exposure part, flash, film stuff like that. but I also had the artistic side in me and they saw my potential. you need to have that 6th sense inside you to be a great photographer. only a few have that. my pictures were garbage for months but each wedding there were more and more keepers. they got the prints back and each wedding sat down with me and told me what I did wrong and right. do this, not this. this is better this is crap. simple and to the point. some people need to analyze and scrutinize pictures. a great photog can see in a split second hwat is good and what is meh or crap.

you must get your gear setup. 2 cameras 2 flashes 3 lenses a must for starting. wa zoom, midrange zoom and tele zoom. must be 2.8 or f/4. at minimum. you must invest in gear to show you are serious and are willing to do what it takes to be elite. its like at job. are you here to give 100% and stay long hours for projects? are you determined and willing to show me that if I invest my time in you that you show me you are ready for serious work? you must be willing to invest for someone to invest in you. I wouldnt want to teach someone months or years only to realize he isnt committed. once a person buys this gear it shows me he is serious. I wouldnt take someone under my wings who came in with a d90 with 2 kit lenses. I couldnt teach him how to truly get pro shots. gear is what will hold back a photog. potential or professional. 2.8 aperture zooms will help you in low light ( and most of the time we are shooting in low light) so you couldnt take advantage with kit gear. and if you have DX you could only go to iso 2000 without having huge chroma noise and heavy smearing. so that very much limits you. they say its the photographer not the gear. nonsense. gear is just as important and in some situation the only reason a photog can be great.
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wud

wud

Senior Member
rocketman122 said:
try to find smaller dress shops. ones who are maybe new and dont have huge budgets for advertising. you can do a studio session for them and you give them the work for free and they use your work and recommend you. make some nice enlargements to place on the wall and make a big album with printed pics. put your logo in the album. you have to invest to go further. no one will comes because you have a nice smile. also you can make a small album with your wedding work so they can show that. you might consider doing a deal with them. weddings dress+photographer for X amount of money. it takes time to get constant work. I say about 5 years of pushing non stop. networking with other vendors. the more the better. dont stop once you get enough work. but thats going to be awhile.
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I am going to a place for pregnant people, some multi-house you could maybe call it, they offer yoga, birth stuff, get-to-gethers after the child are born and so on. I think they would like me to have a poster and some flyers/cards laying there, this could give me a lot of jobs and get me in contact with a lot of new people..


Another thing I will highly recommend is you should consider working for other photographers. especially the veterans. most newbies have their heads up too high with pride and say "what? me? work for someone else? no way." you are missing out on the fastest way to success. lower your head and your pride and dignity and do it. huge pluses. you learn trade secrets from pros whove been dfoing it for years. you dont waste money and time buying gear you thought youd need. you learn tips for honing your skills. and 2 biggest pluses...1, you as the 2nd photographer have many opportunities to get better photos than him. why? because he as the main photog has almost all responsibilty on him to shoot the basic mandatory pics and you have much less resting on your shoulders. you can be creative and walk around and shoot different angles he may not be able to because he has a must capture list thats time restrained and doesnt have time to be creative. for example. in the chuppa/ceremony. my friend is the main photog must get specific photos of the ceremony. I dont have that weight on my shoulders. so I found a high point where I shot some nice pictures from the side. I can even go stand with the guests and get their pov looking at the BG at the ceremony where he must stay close to the BG and capture it should something unveil.
and last huge plus with working for other photogs...you get to practice all the time. you have no stress on you to deliver and if you dont have your own weddings, you get "cold" and you lose your "edge" if you know what I mean. if its been a while since one uses his camera he will lose that edge. by shooting for other photogs you constantly practice and get better. less stress on you to deliver and youll grow more confident. and you need a LOT of confidence to be a good wedding photog. the more confidence the more you "dare" to get amazing pictures.

for instance, you need confidence when you do the formals. people look to you as the photographer to "arrange" them in a pleasing way so they come out as best they can. no confidence, the pictures show. the photog you work for will give that to you. he will slowly push you to better yourself. when you do your own weddings there is so much weight on your shoulders you start to forget, you eff up a lot of things. its a win win. going back to formals portraits. I did a group shot with 20+ family members standing. they all grouped up together. and because im experienced and have confidence I went in and arranged them so they look their best. so I spread them out. BG in the middle always. mother fathers to the sides of the BG and grandma grandpa next tothem kids I bring them in front of the parents but always standing in between so they dont block one person completely. and I joke with them while I do it. I maake them feel at ease. I project my complete confidence and they are relaxed knowing im going to make them look as best as I can (under the situation and lighting) and they sense this. while im arranging them, I give the person a look over and see if they need tidying. men usually their ties need to be tightened and women their bust line is popping out. little details to make sure they look their best. I also joke with the grumpy ones "smile, its such a happy occasion" and they all laugh and enjoy themselves. or the ones who dont shut up, I say to them "shhh, dont talk so loud or theyll hear you in the pictures" and everyone laughs and that breaks the ice and they are relaxed. but if the photographer has no confidence, this will sense this. the pictures come out showing it. the camera doesnt lie. it shows peoples true expressions. in mine, they are smiling, relaxed, enjoying. I make them feel at ease.
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Would love to work for someone else :) My plan are to start school (print technician) while pursuing this photographing, afterwards either apprenticeship or education to be commercial photographer. Somewhere in between, maybe I'll get lucky and find someone to assist for.



good, time to build up your work. see what things are missing. get details sorted out. like a location for shooting the BG. gear you might be missing. practice with the flash more. consider getting slaves and a manual flash or 2 for off camera fill on the dance floor. summer comes there is no time for anything. you should be ready for work. winter is pretty much planning for summer. good job!
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Not doing the dinner and the party. Church, portraits, reception.


btw, the church pictures look flat because the lighting was flat. they was no contrast in the scene. the lighting was diffused from what I see. and the colors are very drab and muted. you deal with what you have. dont boost colors in pictures that have muted light. it will look artificial. its my personal preference but I will critique your 2 first pictures.
the first one is a nice entrance. father has closed eyes or is looking down. before they do the walk down the aisle I always psych them up and say "slow and with pride". the entrance way is beautiful with the arch and I would have been standing straight on and shot with the whole arch and glass setting there. a nice compressed picture at 150mm or so. if I had no place to go back, I would get on one knee and shoot it upwards blurring the arch while they come towards me.

picture two has too much going on. you shot the preist and the setting with the balcony but you were trying to get an atmosphere shot. I would have gone back and opened the WA sigma and got more of the place included.

love the energy in the 3rd, why? because its tightly shot and it makes you feel like you want to lift your hand so you dont get rice in your face. I can feel what the bride was feeling. very powerful feeling of happiness and feeling the pfeww relief "were married" I love tight shots. they are intimate and your eyes are drawn exactly to where you need. in the 2st and 2nd pic its neither here nor there. im giving you my personal opinion. sometimes we as photog shoot what we sense is the right picture but these events are so quick and you dont have much time to think. it will only come from working years in it and from experience of what feels right.
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Yes, I didn't place myself in the middle. I wasn't sure if that was appropriate. This church are a bit different, its placed opposite than a 'normal' church so instead of having entrance and the place the priest stays on the long side, it has it on the short side. So not to much room, which is why I didn't use my zoom.
Everybody was standing around the couple when they were kissing, but I should have moved even closer.

I agree it would probably look better, if I had used a zoom. Thanks for advice, I will take it with me in the preparations.


I will say another thing. regarding pictures I deliver to clients. if they are not photographers themselves, I dont care what they think. Im sounding like a snob haha but I dont get satisfaction if they say good or not. im my own hardest critic. when I am happy inside knowing I captured amazing images then im content and move on to the next event. if Chef Ramsey cooked you a meal and you didnt like it, he is not at fault. he did a fabulous dish. he cooked it perfectly. the fact you didnt like it doesnt mean a thing. give the dish to 100 people and 90% would love it. so who cares if the 10% dont like it. once you start slacking and think "eh, thats good enough" then youre screwed because you stop bettering yourself. like steve jobs ( I dont like the guy btw). he didnt care what others thought. he did what he did because he knew what people wanted. he gave people things they didnt know they want or need. man am I talking too much.
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I know! I feel the same. I want to be really happy with the images, thats my primary goal. But I also know, I am my own best critique, so I think its okay :)
 
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