Need Help buying lense for D800
- Thread starter Yepiz92
- Start date
Maybe Jake could comment here as he has actually used this lens on a D800 rather than people making assumptions.
Edit: I'm going blind in my old age. Seems he already has in post 12 and seems to be pretty impressed with it
Mmmm, I'm getting weird stuff happening with Tapatalk as well. Edited my post and its adding it as a new post
Edit: I'm going blind in my old age. Seems he already has in post 12 and seems to be pretty impressed with it
Mmmm, I'm getting weird stuff happening with Tapatalk as well. Edited my post and its adding it as a new post
BackdoorArts
Senior Member
I've already stated it above - there's nothing I don't like about the 24-85mm on my D600 or my D800. I think people suffer from over-reading blogs by people whose reputation is built upon being overly critical. The idea that a D800 is useless unless you equip it with all but the most expensive and hallowed glass is preposterous. Just look at the DxO review of various lenses on the D800 and you'll see that there is plenty of good glass available for it. What the sensor will do is show any and all flaws in the glass - the question is, can you find them? I would wager that the great majority of people on this forum would be hard pressed to see the difference in images shot with the 24-85mm and a 24-70mm f2.8 "Holy Trinity" lens in 95% of the situations in which you might use them. Yes, there will be situations where the weaknesses of the 24-85mm may be glaring (I haven't found them yet), but you need to ask yourself if you'll ever shoot in those situations, and if so, how often?
If you're a guitar player then you may be familiar with the phrase "Eric Johnson ears", which refer to the ears of a player who swears he can not only hear but is bothered by the difference in his sound depending on things as minute as how excess guitar cable is wound up, or the way in which a power chord is run behind an amplifier. I'm not doubting he can, but I have to laugh when people mimic those things as if their sound will suffer because of it. So when I read posts like, "You won't be happy with that lens", I have to do the same thing, because it's predominantly based on echoing and extrapolating on someone else's opinion. I've yet to see someone post photos showing glaring examples of how all this glass suffers when stuck in front of this magical sensor, and given how long the camera has been around I would have expected to see it by now.
Again, yes, if the lens has a weakness, this sensor will show it. But how "weak" is that weakness? Is it like losing 2 mph on your 100 mph fastball? If so, who cares, because it's still brilliant.
I went through my 2013 photo thread and found several specific posts that mate the two things that should never be mated. Have a looksee, and let me know where the flaws are. I'm an amateur with 2 years in, so I'm not claiming to be anything but a decent hobbiest when it comes to taking photos, so please point not to technique but to obvious flaws in the glass that would prevent you from ever using it.
(Note: there are some D600 photos mixed in, but the exif data should be accessible in each photo)
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...ly-posted-images-2013-version.html#post122114
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...ly-posted-images-2013-version.html#post122228
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...-posted-images-2013-version-3.html#post126922
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...-posted-images-2013-version-3.html#post127296
If you're a guitar player then you may be familiar with the phrase "Eric Johnson ears", which refer to the ears of a player who swears he can not only hear but is bothered by the difference in his sound depending on things as minute as how excess guitar cable is wound up, or the way in which a power chord is run behind an amplifier. I'm not doubting he can, but I have to laugh when people mimic those things as if their sound will suffer because of it. So when I read posts like, "You won't be happy with that lens", I have to do the same thing, because it's predominantly based on echoing and extrapolating on someone else's opinion. I've yet to see someone post photos showing glaring examples of how all this glass suffers when stuck in front of this magical sensor, and given how long the camera has been around I would have expected to see it by now.
Again, yes, if the lens has a weakness, this sensor will show it. But how "weak" is that weakness? Is it like losing 2 mph on your 100 mph fastball? If so, who cares, because it's still brilliant.
I went through my 2013 photo thread and found several specific posts that mate the two things that should never be mated. Have a looksee, and let me know where the flaws are. I'm an amateur with 2 years in, so I'm not claiming to be anything but a decent hobbiest when it comes to taking photos, so please point not to technique but to obvious flaws in the glass that would prevent you from ever using it.
(Note: there are some D600 photos mixed in, but the exif data should be accessible in each photo)
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...ly-posted-images-2013-version.html#post122114
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...ly-posted-images-2013-version.html#post122228
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...-posted-images-2013-version-3.html#post126922
http://nikonites.com/project-365-da...-posted-images-2013-version-3.html#post127296
BackdoorArts
Senior Member
And while you're at it, if you'd like just cruise through the entire set of posts. Given that the D600 has spent most of 2013 with Nikon the majority of them are with the D800, with a mix of primes, the 24-85, 16-35mm f4 (heavens - should I be shooting with the 14-24mm?!), and a Sigma 150-500mm f5-6.3 (surely no one could take a usable photo with that on a D800, could they?!).
Sorry for the overt sarcasm, but I really struggle with people who post in absolutes, both here and anywhere else. Our job as photographers is to know our equipment and how to use it to its full capacity. Know when it works best, and when it falls short - and especially to know that when it does, how to make the most out of it. When you have to start worrying about whether or not your photo will reproduce perfectly in mural size for the client that's paying you four-figures for it, then OK, you might have a point. I suspect that's not most of us here, with or without a D800.
Sorry for the overt sarcasm, but I really struggle with people who post in absolutes, both here and anywhere else. Our job as photographers is to know our equipment and how to use it to its full capacity. Know when it works best, and when it falls short - and especially to know that when it does, how to make the most out of it. When you have to start worrying about whether or not your photo will reproduce perfectly in mural size for the client that's paying you four-figures for it, then OK, you might have a point. I suspect that's not most of us here, with or without a D800.
Jake is so right with these posts. For the vast majority, myself included the last thing screwing up our pictures is the glass. In fact you could say our equipment and still be correct.
I purposely chose the 24-120 over the 24-70 when I went FX as it's a bit more versatile in a number of ways. I recently borrowed a friends 24-70 to compare it with the 24-120 to make sure I'd made the right decision. At 100% + zoom on my 36 megapixel image I could see slightly better resolution on the 24-70, but even for a pixel peeper like me it wasn't enough to make me regret my decision.
The one thing I have learned with the D800 is to get the manfrotto out of the car whenever possible as that makes for very sharp images, even more than glass.
I purposely chose the 24-120 over the 24-70 when I went FX as it's a bit more versatile in a number of ways. I recently borrowed a friends 24-70 to compare it with the 24-120 to make sure I'd made the right decision. At 100% + zoom on my 36 megapixel image I could see slightly better resolution on the 24-70, but even for a pixel peeper like me it wasn't enough to make me regret my decision.
The one thing I have learned with the D800 is to get the manfrotto out of the car whenever possible as that makes for very sharp images, even more than glass.
I agree with much of what Jake said but here's why I stick by what I said:
The original poster said he's going to be opening his own studio which means he expects people to buy his work. I believe that if you want to be a pro you need to act like a pro. And that means professional equipment. You can use the 24-85 and provide good work, the 24-120 or 24-70 for even better, and so on. That's assuming you're talented and understand what good work is. Yes, as Jake said, most people can't tell the difference in small prints or online but if your professional work will include larger prints you owe it to your clients to give your best.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
The original poster said he's going to be opening his own studio which means he expects people to buy his work. I believe that if you want to be a pro you need to act like a pro. And that means professional equipment. You can use the 24-85 and provide good work, the 24-120 or 24-70 for even better, and so on. That's assuming you're talented and understand what good work is. Yes, as Jake said, most people can't tell the difference in small prints or online but if your professional work will include larger prints you owe it to your clients to give your best.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
While the general population wouldn't even know what bokeh or background blur is, it would be important to me to produce it. I really think a wedding deserves the isolation and pleasing background fast glass would produce. Not that you couldn't produce good wedding shots with the 24-85 or 24-120, but a good pro, one who pushes the limits of his gear, will probably get better results with a 24-70 2.8. Not that many would even know the difference, but I would.
I suggested the 24-70 somewhat in jest in response to the instant pro implication of the OP. Personally, I would buy a 50mm1.8g for the D800 now and save for "great" glass later instead of "good" glass now. But.., we all have our own ways of getting there
I suggested the 24-70 somewhat in jest in response to the instant pro implication of the OP. Personally, I would buy a 50mm1.8g for the D800 now and save for "great" glass later instead of "good" glass now. But.., we all have our own ways of getting there
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BackdoorArts
Senior Member
I absolutely agree with the idea that if you plan on shooting professionally and charging for your work, then have the equipment available to produce the best possible results. I just never would have interpreted, "I'm a beginner can anyone help me decide ... I would be doing indoor and outdoor photshoots like graduations, weddings, etc, so which of these 2 is better for this?", as, "He's going to be opening his own studio which means he expects people to buy his work."
BackdoorArts
Senior Member
And lookee here, straight from Nikon, a list of recommended lenses for the D800e. The folks from Nikon Rumors seemed surprised to see the 24-85mm on there, but why shouldn't it be if Nikon is using it in D800 kits? Seems DxO will be releasing their numbers on it tomorrow.
Nikon published an updated list of recommended lenses for the D800E camera | Nikon Rumors
Nikon published an updated list of recommended lenses for the D800E camera | Nikon Rumors
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GeeAirMo
Senior Member
That's good to know. I didn't know that Nikon was packaging the D800 as a Kit with the 24-85?
BackdoorArts
Senior Member
Oops, perhaps not? Must be confusing it with the D600. Could have sworn I'd seen them, but it may be a store-specific kit and not one directly from Nikon.
BackdoorArts
Senior Member
For the curious non-clickers out there, here is the list, which is conspicious in its failure to include a 50mm prime of any kind!!
With cameras like the D800E, which are suited to photography of visually complex subjects, maximizing lens resolution is vital. Though results will vary from lens to lens, the greatest contrast all the way to frame peripheries can generally be achieved at an aperture setting two to three stops down from maximum aperture. Some lenses that offer excellent resolution are listed below.
And remember, this is for the D800E, which, as Nikon points out, "...offers better resolution at aperture settings with which diffraction is not an issue. As the aperture setting has more influence on resolution with the D800E than with the D800, D800E users should always keep the possible effects of diffraction in mind." If I may interpret that slightly, what it says is that you're more likely to experience issues with certain lenses on an 800e than on the regurlar 800 thanks to the absense of the anti-aliasing filter.
With cameras like the D800E, which are suited to photography of visually complex subjects, maximizing lens resolution is vital. Though results will vary from lens to lens, the greatest contrast all the way to frame peripheries can generally be achieved at an aperture setting two to three stops down from maximum aperture. Some lenses that offer excellent resolution are listed below.
- AF-S NIKKOR 14-24mm f/2.8G ED
- AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED
- AF-S NIKKOR 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II
- AF-S NIKKOR 70-200mm f/4G ED VR
- AF-S NIKKOR 16-35mm f/4G ED VR
- AF-S NIKKOR 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5G ED VR
- AF-S NIKKOR 24-120mm f/4G ED VR
- AF-S NIKKOR 200-400mm f/4G ED VR II
- AF-S NIKKOR 24mm f/1.4G ED
- AF-S NIKKOR 28mm f/1.8G
- AF-S NIKKOR 35mm f/1.4G
- AF-S NIKKOR 85mm f/1.4G
- AF-S NIKKOR 85mm f/1.8G
- AF-S NIKKOR 200mm f/2G ED VR II
- AF-S NIKKOR 300mm f/2.8G ED VR II
- AF-S NIKKOR 400mm f/2.8G ED VR
- AF-S NIKKOR 500mm f/4G ED VR
- AF-S NIKKOR 600mm f/4G ED VR
- AF-S Micro NIKKOR 60mm f/2.8G ED
- AF-S VR Micro-Nikkor 105mm f/2.8G IF-ED
- PC-E NIKKOR 24mm f/3.5D ED
- PC-E Micro NIKKOR 45mm f/2.8D ED
- PC-E Micro NIKKOR 85mm f/2.8D
And remember, this is for the D800E, which, as Nikon points out, "...offers better resolution at aperture settings with which diffraction is not an issue. As the aperture setting has more influence on resolution with the D800E than with the D800, D800E users should always keep the possible effects of diffraction in mind." If I may interpret that slightly, what it says is that you're more likely to experience issues with certain lenses on an 800e than on the regurlar 800 thanks to the absense of the anti-aliasing filter.
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The best way to settle this is for you to rent a few lenses.
I highly suggest that every serious photographer set aside money to use toward camera and lens rentals. I have learned so much renting countless times over the years. Don't just rely on reviews, word-of-mouth, or anything else. See for yourself! Rent a lens or camera and design your own experiments based on your style of photography. You will discover many surprises along the way! And your opinion offerings will be truly informed.
I highly suggest that every serious photographer set aside money to use toward camera and lens rentals. I have learned so much renting countless times over the years. Don't just rely on reviews, word-of-mouth, or anything else. See for yourself! Rent a lens or camera and design your own experiments based on your style of photography. You will discover many surprises along the way! And your opinion offerings will be truly informed.
I'm inclinded to agree with 98kellrs question. I assume it is money? Long-term you'll want to trade in the 24-85 and get the 24-70mm. Good glass is even more important on a incredibly high resolution camera like the D800. Actually, I shoot almost exclusively primes. So normally, I'd say get a 35mm, 50mm, and 90mm, but I see why you might want to start with a zoom. JD