How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

[Krs_2007]

Not trying to draw attention to anyone but this article hits the nail on the head for some other places I frequent.

Its a good read, reply with your thoughts if you have them.

How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism" | Fstoppers

 

[STM]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

One thing that separates this site from many out there is that there appears to be more of a kinship here. We are not in competition with anyone for customers. I try to give as constructive a criticism as I can with the end goal that hopefully it will help the person improve their skills. No matter how good you are, there is always going to be someone who is better than you. That is true for pretty much every walk of life. Photography, like most endeavors is a process of constant learning. If you honestly feel that you no longer have anything to learn about photography, then you probably ought to sell all your gear and go do something else.

As far as receiving criticism, there will always be people be people who know nothing about what they are talking about and people who are very knowledgeable. I don't take it personally, unless you tell me I am a "%)#(&(#" to which I reply "after more than two decades in the Infantry I have been called far worse, you are a rank amateur in the art of calling people names".

When it comes to critiquing anything, I was always taught to point out good points and then point out things "where you could perhaps improve", a lot of times it is not so much what you say, but how you say it. We are all human, and sometimes let emotions get the best of us but if you try to follow that rule you will always be better off. The golden rule of "praise in public, criticize in private" is always a good rule to follow. If an image is especially bad, use a PM instead of a public comment.

 

[mikew_RIP]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

We have had a couple of the only right way to do it is my way merchants but they didn't last long i think we need to remember there is no body language in a posted reply,smileys help but dont always do it.

 

[Thumper_6119]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

One thing that separates this site from many out there is that there appears to be more of a kinship here. We are not in competition with anyone for customers. I try to give as constructive a criticism as I can with the end goal that hopefully it will help the person improve their skills. No matter how good you are, there is always going to be someone who is better than you. That is true for pretty much every walk of life. Photography, like most endeavors is a process of constant learning. If you honestly feel that you no longer have anything to learn about photography, then you probably ought to sell all your gear and go do something else.

As far as receiving criticism, there will always be people be people who know nothing about what they are talking about and people who are very knowledgeable. I don't take it personally, unless you tell me I am a "%)#(&(#" to which I reply "after more than two decades in the Infantry I have been called far worse, you are a rank amateur in the art of calling people names".

When it comes to critiquing anything, I was always taught to point out good points and then point out things "where you could perhaps improve", a lot of times it is not so much what you say, but how you say it. We are all human, and sometimes let emotions get the best of us but if you try to follow that rule you will always be better off. The golden rule of "praise in public, criticize in private" is always a good rule to follow. If an image is especially bad, use a PM instead of a public comment.

Can I get an "Amen"?

I hope to be a student of all things until I finally reach the grave. I like constructive criticism, and I receive it well. It is how I learn from others and I grow. It doesn't take a thick skin to receive constructive criticism, but it can sometimes help. (I used to work in the psych ward of a maximum security prison, so I have been subjected to some the most profane, vulgar, and creative verbal abuse that I could have even imagined).

I did make the mistake of telling someone once "Don't fan my ass and tell me something that I do is great if it isn't. Give it to me straight so I can improve." The response was "Okay. Your works sucks, you stink, and you've got no friends." I knew right then that I had to marry her. (17 years this coming Sunday).

 

[Eyelight]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

We humans have a way of losing word meanings over time. I'm using the 3rd definition of criticism from Bing: "assessment of creative work: considered judgment of or discussion about the qualities of something, especially a creative work"

I agree with the gist of the article.

The first thing on the list being the most important, knowing when someone wants criticism and when they don't.

And something the article does not mention, but perhaps more important is knowing the level of the artist you are criticizing. I think this especially applies in a setting like a photography forum where the mix of experience and talent has extreme limits.

The sole purpose of criticism in a learning environment is improvement. If the criticism one has to offer is not for the betterment of the artist or the work, then one is on the verge of failing miserably as a critic.

 

[STM]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

One of the greatest drawbacks to the internet is that words must be taken purely at face value. Facial expressions and voice inflection are totally absent.

Something spoken in jest person to person can be easily mistaken for malicious on the web. I have a very sarcastic and biting wit, it comes from over two decades of living in one of the "toughest crowds" on the planet.......US Army Infantry. So if I bust on you, 99% of the time it is just a innocent and good natured ribbing. But for us grunts the overwhelming majority of it was in jest. But to the outside observer it would come across as "man, these guys HATE each other!" It is an extraordinarily stressful environment and ribbing each other is a way of dealing with it. I was closer to many of my soldiers than I was to my own brother and sister. Combat has a way of doing that to people.

This is something we all have to be cognizant of when posting. So before you post the "send" button, think about how your words will be perceived by the recipient in the absence of face to face contact.

 

[Blacktop]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

I have a very sensitive inner child.

 

[Rick M]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

I have a very sensitive inner child.

As long as everyone else in your head isn't overly sensitive you should be ok

 

[Browncoat]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

We've had a few Sensitive Sallies here on Nikonites with regards to critiques. I remember one guy who totally flipped out. But 99.9% of the time, feedback here is good because the community here is good. I'm one of the harshest critics on this site, and I'm tame compared to most of the other sites out there. There are several pros and semi-pros here who have a genuine interest in helping others. That's the main ingredient that makes the community here so good: tolerance and acceptance of different skill levels. So many other forums have a very prevalent Pros vs Joes attitude, and there's a lot of elitism.

 

[Tom Grove]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

Good article, and very good replies. Whenever I'm asked to give CC, I like to keep in mind that the person on the receiving end is probably very proud of their work. Giving feedback can be a delicate thing. Sometimes when a person says "give me feedback", what they mean is "please tell me it's good." So if I have anything negative or constructive to say, I tend to try to find 2-3 good things to say and 1 or 2 ways "I might have tried something different."

Just for the record... I like CC on every picture I post, and by that I mean shoot me straight. I am a guy who is very proud of my work, but by the same token I want my work to be something I can be proud of. So definitely... Please give me ideas, pointers, feedback, tutorials, and all the help I can get so I can improve, and compliments so I know what I'm doing right too!

 

[STM]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

I have a very sensitive inner child.

Nothing that taking it out back and PT'ing the dogs**t out of it won't help!

"Toughen up or get used to getting your lunch money taken from you, son!"

 

[Phillydog1958]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

One of the most challenging duties of any workplace manager, is to critique an employee's job performance. There is an old management rule of thumb that loosely states that when a manager has that task, he or she should always start off with the positives . . . then transition to those dreaded "Negatives." It sets a positive tone and makes one feel adequate. Also, keep it short and sweet, but be direct and respectful.

 

[RocketCowboy]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

One thing that separates this site from many out there is that there appears to be more of a kinship here.

This, right here. I wouldn't hesitate to meet anyone for a beer/soda/tea that I've interacted with here, and I think this gets to the core. I don't know how this kind of energy of kinship develops on some forums and is totally void on others, but this group has been very helpful in providing input to pictures I've posed or suggestions to questions I've posed.

 

[Rick M]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

It's too bad that we have not been successful with the critique forum. Despite several attempts over the 3+ years I've been here, we just can't make/keep it meaningful.

 

[Krs_2007]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

Yea, I tried it once and got a few hits so honestly I will only use for something I really want critique on. I don't know if it's confusing or intimidating to others so can't speak to why more don't use it. I like the star rating but also like the comments. Is it possible to remove the like from just that one section, so you have to use the rating or comment. Just a thought.

I do find it extremely valuable for constructive criticism and always read them to increase my knowledge and open my eyes to other perspectives on photography.

It seems most of us are satisfied with just having our own threads and/or posting in themed threads.

 

[Browncoat]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

It's too bad that we have not been successful with the critique forum. Despite several attempts over the 3+ years I've been here, we just can't make/keep it meaningful.

That's an issue on every single photo forum. At least we don't have the infighting here that runs rampant on the others.

We all need to do a better job with critiques.

 

[Tom Grove]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

That's an issue on every single photo forum. At least we don't have the infighting here that runs rampant on the others.

We all need to do a better job with critiques.

I realize we have the critique thread, but since I've been doing the 360 daily thread, most of my photo posts have been redundant. I extend an open invitation to everybody to offer any feedback on any and all of my pics. I love the great compliments, but the ideas and pointers for improvement have been a tremendous help for me. I've been here just over a month, and I have improved in many ways thanks to you guys (and gals).

 

[Horoscope Fish]

Re: How To Bring The "Constructive" Back To "Constructive Criticism"

That's an issue on every single photo forum. At least we don't have the infighting here that runs rampant on the others.

We all need to do a better job with critiques.

I know I hesitate to critique because I have to ask myself if I'm really knowledgeable enough TO critique someone else's photography. I hope I'm not hurting anyone's feelings when I say I value the feedback of some members more than others because, too be blunt about it, I feel some posters around here have a deeper knowledge of what makes for GOOD photography. It's nice to get "Likes" but critique is another matter entirely. I take critique seriously and I guess that's why I hesitate to do it.

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