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Nikon DSLR Cameras
D800/D800E
Damn Auto-ISO and speedlight
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<blockquote data-quote="WayneF" data-source="post: 662791" data-attributes="member: 12496"><p>FWIW, I agree with you. We need other menus too, one to prevent D-lens from frequently ruining TTL BL flash exposure, and another to force TTL (vs TTL BL) without having to set Spot metering (which likely messes up ambient). We have menus for some of the most mundane things, but are missing some of the important features of automatic flash control.</p><p></p><p> But was this D800 on the camera then, able to communicate with the camera? Because if a D800 recognized a flash was present, D800 ISO should have advanced only 2 EV, to 4x ISO (like 400 to 1600 ISO). If this 4x increase were from ISO 100 to ISO 400, that would be just about right for indoor bounce flash. But IMO, higher ISO only just means the flash level is always reduced to fill flash level, which might be great if planned that way, but not by surprise.</p><p></p><p>Nikon has gone through a few phases with Auto ISO and flash. The earlier Nikon DSLR models (D70, D80, D200, D40, etc) always did exactly what you want. Auto ISO would NEVER advance past minimum if a flash was detected present. That lasted until the D300S in 2009, when then ISO would always fully advance as determined by the ambient. Except even today, Auto ISO still will not advance if a manual flash is detected (manual flash cannot react to ISO changing).</p><p></p><p>Then after 2009 (D300S and later, for only a few models, like the D3000 and D5000), Nikon cameras went through a phase where Auto ISO was always determined by the ambient light level, and the flash had to work into any higher ISO that it might discover present, and it became fill level then. And any well-exposed indoor ambient is normally orange or green, different color than the flash. We had to turn Auto ISO off to use flash. I suspect this was an unfortunate push towards their "balanced flash solves all" concept, but Auto ISO does not work well with flash. We can of course always turn Auto ISO off.</p><p></p><p>And it was bad, and it lasted only a short time, roughly a year, until changed again. Nikon Auto ISO with flash philosophy changed again in 2010, affecting from D7000, D5100, D3200 and following, including D800 in 2012. And now, if Auto ISO is on, ISO will advance at most only 2 EV (or to 4x ISO). Which was good if ISO 100 minimum and using bounce flash.</p><p></p><p>So now (including the D800), Auto ISO should advance at most only up to 4x ISO if a flash is detected present (if it can communicate with the camera). That 4x can still be quite high if the Minimum ISO was already set high.</p><p></p><p>If the D800 camera (and later models today) recognize that a manual flash is present, or if using the Commander, then Auto ISO would be ignored, and ISO would Not advance past the minimum setting. If no flash was recognized present, then Auto ISO is determined by the ambient level. And a recognized TTL flash might advance 2 EV, up to 4x Minimum ISO. But even at 4x, if the ISO goes high enough to make the indoor ambient seem normal lighting, then the TTL flash is metered as only fill level.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="WayneF, post: 662791, member: 12496"] FWIW, I agree with you. We need other menus too, one to prevent D-lens from frequently ruining TTL BL flash exposure, and another to force TTL (vs TTL BL) without having to set Spot metering (which likely messes up ambient). We have menus for some of the most mundane things, but are missing some of the important features of automatic flash control. But was this D800 on the camera then, able to communicate with the camera? Because if a D800 recognized a flash was present, D800 ISO should have advanced only 2 EV, to 4x ISO (like 400 to 1600 ISO). If this 4x increase were from ISO 100 to ISO 400, that would be just about right for indoor bounce flash. But IMO, higher ISO only just means the flash level is always reduced to fill flash level, which might be great if planned that way, but not by surprise. Nikon has gone through a few phases with Auto ISO and flash. The earlier Nikon DSLR models (D70, D80, D200, D40, etc) always did exactly what you want. Auto ISO would NEVER advance past minimum if a flash was detected present. That lasted until the D300S in 2009, when then ISO would always fully advance as determined by the ambient. Except even today, Auto ISO still will not advance if a manual flash is detected (manual flash cannot react to ISO changing). Then after 2009 (D300S and later, for only a few models, like the D3000 and D5000), Nikon cameras went through a phase where Auto ISO was always determined by the ambient light level, and the flash had to work into any higher ISO that it might discover present, and it became fill level then. And any well-exposed indoor ambient is normally orange or green, different color than the flash. We had to turn Auto ISO off to use flash. I suspect this was an unfortunate push towards their "balanced flash solves all" concept, but Auto ISO does not work well with flash. We can of course always turn Auto ISO off. And it was bad, and it lasted only a short time, roughly a year, until changed again. Nikon Auto ISO with flash philosophy changed again in 2010, affecting from D7000, D5100, D3200 and following, including D800 in 2012. And now, if Auto ISO is on, ISO will advance at most only 2 EV (or to 4x ISO). Which was good if ISO 100 minimum and using bounce flash. So now (including the D800), Auto ISO should advance at most only up to 4x ISO if a flash is detected present (if it can communicate with the camera). That 4x can still be quite high if the Minimum ISO was already set high. If the D800 camera (and later models today) recognize that a manual flash is present, or if using the Commander, then Auto ISO would be ignored, and ISO would Not advance past the minimum setting. If no flash was recognized present, then Auto ISO is determined by the ambient level. And a recognized TTL flash might advance 2 EV, up to 4x Minimum ISO. But even at 4x, if the ISO goes high enough to make the indoor ambient seem normal lighting, then the TTL flash is metered as only fill level. [/QUOTE]
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Nikon DSLR Cameras
D800/D800E
Damn Auto-ISO and speedlight
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