Boat sailed away!

[Joseph Bautsch]

Composition is not about "rules" it's about pleasing the human Psyche and that never changes. For thousands of years artists (Photographers over less time) have tried to reduce this process down to these rules and it dosen't really work very well. There are many factors, "rules", that go into making a photo pleasing to the Psyche. In a photo a combination of some of these "rules" can be stronger than the rule of thirds making it acceptable to break that rule. In this case the other parts of the composition are not strong enough to make it acceptable to break of the rule of thirds. The Psyche does not like having to try and look at two shots at the same time, one shot divided in half. That's why there is a rule of thirds. Make one half or the other the dominate subject. Move the mountains and sky up into the top third and make the lake and reflections dominate or move the lake and reflections down into the bottom third and make the mountains and sky dominate. You have two very good pictures here, divide the shot into two separate ones. Don't try to display them as one, it dosen't work.

 

[theregsy]

Now you see to me this is the same discussion as to why some people think that a Jackson Pollock painting is wonderful and others don't, looking at things like Constables Hay Wain or some of Ansel Adams landscapes they do not all confirm to the rule of thirds. I shoot the way I want to shoot and crop into a form that pleases me. It is all down to a personal taste, I could show that picture to 50 people and get 50 different responses as to what was good or bad about it, and would probably end up with a 50-50 split on if it was a good picture or not.
I have tried a different crop, and it just doesn't work for me, it might for you. More comments welcome.

 

[ohkphoto]

I shoot the way I want to shoot and crop into a form that pleases me. It is all down to a personal taste, I could show that picture to 50 people and get 50 different responses as to what was good or bad about it, and would probably end up with a 50-50 split on if it was a good picture or not.

This is why most of us classify most photography as art. When you post to the critique forum and ask for comments, you are going to get the commenter's opinion. The benefit of a good critique is that you get to see your photo through another photographer's eye. It doesn't mean you have to change what you do, but the good photographer/artist is always "training the eye" to maybe see things differently. Part of that is asking the viewer, "do you see what I see, or what do you see that I don't see."

IMHO

 

[JoeLewisPhotography]

I shoot the way I want to shoot and crop into a form that pleases me. It is all down to a personal taste

This is true, but in all fairness, you did ask for the photo to be critisized.

I think the crop is better as your eyes are more drawn to the prize of the picture, which are the mountains. Before, they went to the shore first....that tree and rock are still drstracting to me.

 

[theregsy]

I apologise if I came over a bit strong, while I honestly do appreciate the comments and the other points of view (like Marcels colour fix) I agree that knowledge wise I know very little, I do not have a lot of experience in comparison to a lot of you here and I know my technique style are still very much in the development stages, I still shoot very much from the heart. I do however also believe that as soon as art starts to follow any kind of 'rule' or guideline it can cease to be creative, I personally dislike a lot of the modern art but accept that a lot of it is from people breaking the mould as to what art is. I mean it when I say that I appreciate the feedback and I am not trying to change anyone elses mind about my choice of shot but to be TOLD that my shot is wrong because it should adhere to the rule of thirds is a personal point of view but it sounds more like a you MUST take photographs in a prescribed manner or it won't work.

If you see what I mean? LOL I am not terribly good at getting accross what I am trying to say, I am not trying to upset anyone or try to tell anyone that my way is right and like I say every one has a different take on any image and a point of view that is purely there own, I do listen and I will try different things to improve as I develop my style and talent (I Hope LOL)

I would like to say that although I have posted the crop above, it doesn't work for my taste, I prefer the complete image from earlier, I actually prefer Marcels version

Vive la difference

 

[Carolina Photo Guy]

You know something? There is a reason that Jackson Pollock's work is in high demand. He knows the rules. You cannot consistently break the rules unless you know the rules.

The rule of thirds is also known as the Golden Mean. Sometimes it like ballet dancing. Just because a dancer wants to try to dance Swan Lake in clodhoppers, does not mean its a good idea. But ballet dancers know the rules of grace and harmony that are inherent in the Swan and so they pay homage to the rules.

Break all the rules that you want. But know which rules that you are breaking. THAT is what makes art. The other way makes chaos.

Either way, satisfy yourself. Because, in the end, you are your first client.

Hope this helps.

Pete

 

[fotojack]

Personally, I like Marcel's version, too, with the colour corrections. And quite frankly, the tree on the left doesn't bother me at all. My first view of this shot is right down the middle towards the back of the shot, where the mountains meet the water. Then my eyes drift over the picture, taking in everything in sort of a peripheral way.
Criticism is not always easy to take. As long as the criticizer is not personally attacking the person being critiqued, then it should be considered being helpful. The person(s) giving the critique are providing their personal opinions on the subject, not dictating on how anything should or should not be done. Yes, there are rules, and yes, some rules are meant to be twisted or bent......to a certain degree. But as Pete said.......you have to know which rules are being twisted or bent first. Makes sense, right? Art is indeed a psyche thing, each of us interpreting what he/she sees in their own unique way. So.....to summarize.....when asking for a critique, be prepared for the answers, whether you like them or not.
Before you jump all over me, theregsy, believe me, I DO totally understand your point of view and what you said. And no, we don't take offense on how you replied. We're here to help each other......from the pro to the novice. We can all learn from each other, and that's what we'll continue to do here at Nikonites. These are my opinions and not necessarily those of the management.

 

[theregsy]

Jack, that's the most balanced and well thought out critique of the picture that I have seen. What, I think, got my dander up a little is that I do know the rule of thirds and use it a bit or at least try not to shoot with the main item dead square center. I know a little about what makes a good photo. In this case, I think what I really like is the symmetry of the image and, OK, so that doesn't work for everyone, I accept that, but the tone of some of the critiques read as... 'you have done it wrong, it doesn't obey these rules, it's wrong... not... 'well I would prefer, or do you think that it would be better if'?
I may be being over touchy about the picture, we all know it's down to our personal preferences and vision but like the Pollock comments I made I really don't like or get that style of art, but I would not tell anyone it's wrong. If anyone gave me a pollock I would sell it and look for a constable

I will try and keep my dander down and again thanks everyone for looking and commenting