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  1. #11
    Senior Member
    Rick M's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI
    Quote Originally Posted by mikew View Post
    I haven't got the full-size images for the de-noise images, they were of no use to me,

    You could give it a free try if you wanted, love a man with a sense of humor you want to see a 100% crop from a DX @ ISO 36,000



    https://topazlabs.com/denoise-ai/


    Attachment 330735



    This is from the Sigma 100-400 not the NIKON
    How did you like the results? More effective than just LR?


    › See More: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI
    Rick

    http://www.rmillsphotography.com/

    Nikon Z7, Nikon Z s 50mm 1.8
    Nikonite
    Tee-shirt, lens cloth and business cards!




  2. #12
    Senior Member
    mikew's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick M View Post
    How did you like the results? More effective than just LR?
    I never use light room only photoshop, at the moment from only doing stupid high iso shots i cant see its worth the money, i have 30 days to play so will at some point give it a go with 10/15000 iso shots.
    Mike



    https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

    Nikon Z50,Nikon16-50MM,Nikon50-250MM,FTZ Adapter
    Sigma 100-400, Sigma 105mm macro
    Nikon V2,10-30MM,30-110MM FT1 Adapter













  3. #13
    Staff
    Super Mod
    hark's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI
    Quote Originally Posted by Rick M View Post
    How did you like the results? More effective than just LR?
    Rick, did you see this post by Jake showing how much detail can be brought back with Topaz AI? Here's the link to the thread as well as Jake's actual post. This is an impressive demonstration.

    https://nikonites.com/telephoto/4407...tml#post723899

    Quote Originally Posted by BackdoorArts View Post
    So a couple of things. First, you're wide open at f6.7 so if it's gonna be soft with the 1.7x it's going to be there. But these really aren't that bad. I was using the 1.7x on rare occasion with the 300mm but I just wasn't crazy about the details I'd lose so if I put a TC on it would be the 1.4x (it's a moot point now that I have the 500mm f5.6).

    With that said, as I mentioned in another thread I've fallen hard for a trio of Topaz AI filters - DeNoise, Sharpen, and Adjust. I use them in that order instead of using the sharpening and denoise in ACR. I only use Sharpen AI in cases where I'm trying to save a photo that's almost sharp (DeNoise has a very good sharpening function). While these photos are more than acceptably sharp I suspect they could benefit from them - as could some of the 1.7x shots I've never processed. It has 3 different sharpening modes: Sharpen, Focus, Stabilize. The first is not much better than what you get in ACR or Topaz DeNoise AI and I don't use it often as the filter can be very slow (turn the auto preview off and just refresh as needed). But the other two do a more than good job of salvaging stuff that's just a bit soft.

    Here's a shot taken of a pair of mating Red Tailed Hawks I took from my Mom's front stoop. This is a 100% crop with the 500mm so they were a little too far off to really get. The bottom is straight out of camera (I've darkened it slightly so you can see the line) and the top is after applying all 3 filters. It's not "great", but it's something I could do a small print of or share online with a little more work.

    Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI-329441-what-your-thoughts-j55_9088-edit-copy.jpg
    Cindy
    Flickr
    and My 2020 Thread

    Where the Spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art
    -- Leonardo da Vinci



  4. #14
    Senior Member
    Rick M's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Quote Originally Posted by hark View Post
    Rick, did you see this post by Jake showing how much detail can be brought back with Topaz AI? Here's the link to the thread as well as Jake's actual post. This is an impressive demonstration.

    https://nikonites.com/telephoto/4407...tml#post723899
    Yes, but it appears the Sharpen package is replaced by Denoise and not as good?
    Rick

    http://www.rmillsphotography.com/

    Nikon Z7, Nikon Z s 50mm 1.8
    Nikonite
    Tee-shirt, lens cloth and business cards!


  5. #15
    Senior Member

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick M View Post
    Yes, but it appears the Sharpen package is replaced by Denoise and not as good?
    There's actually 3 AI tools that impact Sharpening. Denoise AI is generally sufficient to bring a clear, in focus image into maximum sharpness. Sharpen AI is available as well and while it's not magic I have used it to take soft images (either slightly missed focus, just a soft lens, or even with slight movement) and make them usable. Then there's Adjust AI which has sections for clarity, detail, and sharpening, and while I would not use it purely for sharpening it is really good at bringing out details without boosting noise - but it takes some playing with to understand how the detail and boost sliders interact (you almost need to use them in opposite directions - add small details, decrease the associated boost).

    You do not need Sharpen AI if your images are generally in focus, Denoise AI is enough in my experience, particularly when going to Adjust AI next. Sharpen AI is a dog on CPU, so if you need it make sure you have nothing else open. And for both Denoise and Sharpen make sure you open them up first with no image and turn off the Auto Preview switch as you can wind up waiting minutes every time you nudge a slider, though Sharpen is far worse.

    My workflow has basically become:
    1. Use Lightroom to crop and straighten, applying lens profile correction and white balance.
    2. Denoise AI to remove noise and apply sharpening (I may also play with the auto light correction)
    3. Add Levels and or Curves adjustment layer if necessary. If I need to remove anything from the frame it happens here, after Denoise, not before it.
    4. Sharpen AI only if I'm trying to save an image
    5. Adjust AI to further clarify and sharpen
    6. Camera Raw Filter where I'll do all the lighting adjustments I used to do in Lightroom ahead of time. Denoise is most effective when you haven't messed with the light.


    From there then it's maybe dodge/burn and whatever other local tweaks I want to apply. I've almost abandoned NiK tools entirely unless I'm going B&W. I'm really impressed with them.

    Hey, and if any of you wind up buying it you can save an additional 15% if you use this link to get there (and yes, I get credit for the referral).
    Last edited by BackdoorArts; 02-09-2020 at 06:44 PM.
    Thanks/Like hark, Rick M Thanks/liked this post
     
    Jake
    (formerly backdoorhippie)

  6. #16
    Senior Member
    mikew's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI
    Quote Originally Posted by Horoscope Fish View Post
    There's that, but I also notice some distinct differences in the background. Look just below and to the right of the bird's beak. There is a "splotch" of green in the first image that is not present in the second image. From that green splotch, continue down and to the right just a little bit more... There are a couple of brown streaks in the water that parallel one another in the first shot that are not present in the second image.
    They are taken from this burst and processed individually,as you can see even if i cocked up and selected the wrong one it wouldn't matter

    Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI-capturemm.jpg
    Mike



    https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

    Nikon Z50,Nikon16-50MM,Nikon50-250MM,FTZ Adapter
    Sigma 100-400, Sigma 105mm macro
    Nikon V2,10-30MM,30-110MM FT1 Adapter













  7. #17
    Senior Member
    Rick M's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Quote Originally Posted by BackdoorArts View Post
    There's actually 3 AI tools that impact Sharpening. Denoise AI is generally sufficient to bring a clear, in focus image into maximum sharpness. Sharpen AI is available as well and while it's not magic I have used it to take soft images (either slightly missed focus, just a soft lens, or even with slight movement) and make them usable. Then there's Adjust AI which has sections for clarity, detail, and sharpening, and while I would not use it purely for sharpening it is really good at bringing out details without boosting noise - but it takes some playing with to understand how the detail and boost sliders interact (you almost need to use them in opposite directions - add small details, decrease the associated boost).

    You do not need Sharpen AI if your images are generally in focus, Denoise AI is enough in my experience, particularly when going to Adjust AI next. Sharpen AI is a dog on CPU, so if you need it make sure you have nothing else open. And for both Denoise and Sharpen make sure you open them up first with no image and turn off the Auto Preview switch as you can wind up waiting minutes every time you nudge a slider, though Sharpen is far worse.

    My workflow has basically become:
    1. Use Lightroom to crop and straighten, applying lens profile correction and white balance.
    2. Denoise AI to remove noise and apply sharpening (I may also play with the auto light correction)
    3. Add Levels and or Curves adjustment layer if necessary. If I need to remove anything from the frame it happens here, after Denoise, not before it.
    4. Sharpen AI only if I'm trying to save an image
    5. Adjust AI to further clarify and sharpen
    6. Camera Raw Filter where I'll do all the lighting adjustments I used to do in Lightroom ahead of time. Denoise is most effective when you haven't messed with the light.


    From there then it's maybe dodge/burn and whatever other local tweaks I want to apply. I've almost abandoned NiK tools entirely unless I'm going B&W. I'm really impressed with them.

    Hey, and if any of you wind up buying it you can save an additional 15% if you use this link to get there (and yes, I get credit for the referral).
    Thank you for the in-depth explanation Jake, appreciated.
    Rick

    http://www.rmillsphotography.com/

    Nikon Z7, Nikon Z s 50mm 1.8
    Nikonite
    Tee-shirt, lens cloth and business cards!


  8. #18
    Senior Member
    Woodyg3's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    My computer's graphics processor does not have enough memory to use Topaz, unfortunately. I haven't decided whether to hotrod my current computer with new GP, Hard Drive and RAM, or get a new computer. Either way it's more money than I can really afford. Poor me!!!
    Woody Green

    Clear Eyes, Full Hearts, Can't Lose

    D500, D7200, D7100, D70

  9. #19
    Senior Member
    Whiskeyman's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Quote Originally Posted by Woodyg3 View Post
    My computer's graphics processor does not have enough memory to use Topaz, unfortunately. I haven't decided whether to hotrod my current computer with new GP, Hard Drive and RAM, or get a new computer. Either way it's more money than I can really afford. Poor me!!!
    What kind of computer are you using, Woody?

    WM
    "Beware of men with theories that explain everything. Trust those who approach the world with humility and cautious insight." - Mark Bowden

  10. #20
    Senior Member
    Woodyg3's Avatar

    Re: Z50 and Topaz denoise-AI

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiskeyman View Post
    What kind of computer are you using, Woody?

    WM
    iMac late 2013 with 8gb RAM and a slow-assed 1tb hard drive. All my picture files live on external hard drives.
    Woody Green

    Clear Eyes, Full Hearts, Can't Lose

    D500, D7200, D7100, D70





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