Did some messing around today

Jtedlin

Senior Member
Went out today since it has been a while and these are the two I felt were decent enough to post. Let me know what you guys think/what you would of done different.

EvansvilleII.jpg
First off is a photo of my cities riverfront at 1/640 second ISO 100 28mm at f/5.0

stream.jpg
Second off is a creek That I wanted to do a longer exposure of, exposure time was 20 seconds ISO 100 from 44mm at f/5.3



Thanks for looking!
Josh
 

Michael J.

Senior Member
I think the first photo looks better if there is like a panorama style. Cut the sky and the water a bit. But I'm not sure it looks better.
 

crycocyon

Senior Member
First it is great to see you are getting out and just shooting what you think is interesting. That being said, and based on your two photos, I would think carefully about a scene in terms of what is the center of attention and where would you like the viewer's eyes to be directed to first. What is it about the scene that first grabs your attention? I would ask yourself that. Now I agree that even though the first one is a landscape, the 28 mm takes in too much of the water and the sky. The buildings make for a nice skyline but they are too far away. I would use even a short telephoto for this scene so that the buildings and landscape make up 2/3rds of the image and the sky and water make up the remaining third.

So for the stream image, it is commendable that you attempted to get a flowing effect with the longer exposure. But actually, even just 2-5 seconds would have been fine. Also I think that the long exposure has shifted the color a bit which is common with some sensors, so that would be another reason to stay away from too long an exposure. Going back to the question of center of interest, I see rocks and water and a shore and some foreground, but there isn't really a center of attention, apart from perhaps the pyramid-shaped rock dead center in the frame. That rock is interesting, but it is dead center which renders it a bit less interesting, because the eye goes to it, then the water flows around it like it is an obstacle. What would be better is that it is off to the left a bit on the 2/3rd line and then the water flows down from that center of interest. Also, we think of water flowing down a stream. So I would have shot down toward the stream a bit with the stream going to a diagonal with respect to the frame to enhance the impression of flowing down. As it is shot, the stream flows perfectly horizontally across the frame, which doesn't give the flow the same kind of weight.

In a nutshell, often we look at a scene and expect then to photograph it as we see it, just because it would seem natural that that is how we should photograph it, as it is. However, the art in photography is being able to find within the scene a story, or what about the scene communicates something beyond what the subject matter really is when one just walks casually past it. If someone were to paint the same scenes, yes they would probably try to make it look the same as the scene, but for a photographer it is more of a challenge to render the scene in some way apart from what we normally would see to give it an identity of its own, to lend a personal style to the image. Every image you take from now on has to convey something of your own personal style and you should ask yourself "Can I photograph this in a way that reflects what I want to see in the scene?". If you are confident that you can, then proceed. If you are not confident or if the subject just isn't "cooperating", then leave it and move onto the next subject.
 

crycocyon

Senior Member
Here's a little bit about what I meant (I know, a picture is worth a few hundred words). :)

Joshua1.jpg

Joshua2.jpg

You could even try the first one as a black and white if the color is just too strange...

Joshua1bw.jpg

Note that when it becomes a black and white image, it becomes a pure exercise in terms of tonal range and detail.
 

Jtedlin

Senior Member
First it is great to see you are getting out and just shooting what you think is interesting. That being said, and based on your two photos, I would think carefully about a scene in terms of what is the center of attention and where would you like the viewer's eyes to be directed to first. What is it about the scene that first grabs your attention? I would ask yourself that. Now I agree that even though the first one is a landscape, the 28 mm takes in too much of the water and the sky. The buildings make for a nice skyline but they are too far away. I would use even a short telephoto for this scene so that the buildings and landscape make up 2/3rds of the image and the sky and water make up the remaining third.

So for the stream image, it is commendable that you attempted to get a flowing effect with the longer exposure. But actually, even just 2-5 seconds would have been fine. Also I think that the long exposure has shifted the color a bit which is common with some sensors, so that would be another reason to stay away from too long an exposure. Going back to the question of center of interest, I see rocks and water and a shore and some foreground, but there isn't really a center of attention, apart from perhaps the pyramid-shaped rock dead center in the frame. That rock is interesting, but it is dead center which renders it a bit less interesting, because the eye goes to it, then the water flows around it like it is an obstacle. What would be better is that it is off to the left a bit on the 2/3rd line and then the water flows down from that center of interest. Also, we think of water flowing down a stream. So I would have shot down toward the stream a bit with the stream going to a diagonal with respect to the frame to enhance the impression of flowing down. As it is shot, the stream flows perfectly horizontally across the frame, which doesn't give the flow the same kind of weight.

In a nutshell, often we look at a scene and expect then to photograph it as we see it, just because it would seem natural that that is how we should photograph it, as it is. However, the art in photography is being able to find within the scene a story, or what about the scene communicates something beyond what the subject matter really is when one just walks casually past it. If someone were to paint the same scenes, yes they would probably try to make it look the same as the scene, but for a photographer it is more of a challenge to render the scene in some way apart from what we normally would see to give it an identity of its own, to lend a personal style to the image. Every image you take from now on has to convey something of your own personal style and you should ask yourself "Can I photograph this in a way that reflects what I want to see in the scene?". If you are confident that you can, then proceed. If you are not confident or if the subject just isn't "cooperating", then leave it and move onto the next subject.

This is why I joined this forum, for tips and help like this! I appreciate the response, and have just a few questions :). Firstly I would like to ask if you feel a 55-200mm would of been the better of my two lenses for the skyline of the city. I do plan on trying again when work allows me some more free time. Also, on the stream, I used a ND400 9 stop Neutral Density filter, and the lowest the calculator suggested was 16 -20 seconds (I use the NDcalc on my iphone) So would that make a large difference on the coloring the of the photo? Out of an entire day spent taking photos of just random things, these were the only ones I felt that turned out, And I am extremely glad I got the responses I did. I need to start working on telling the scenes story like you said instead of having the mindset, oh I like this, let me snag a photo of it. I love the black and white edit you made of the stream, and with the skyline I can see how it looks a lot better if the actual skyline was a bit more of the focus. Thank you for the help and I will try to post some photos that I feel tell a story once I can!

Josh
 

crycocyon

Senior Member
So yes the 55-200 would be better...probably at 100-150 mm I would guess. Also I would try evening lighting rather than mid-day lighting. When I think about going out to do photography, I first look outside at the weather and the lighting and if it is suitable to what my subject matter will be. If there are no clouds, then I'll have to deal with additional contrast to the image and possible unwanted highlights. If there are a few clouds, then great because I have a choice to wait for a cloud or go with the direct sunlight. I have a choice then. If it is overcast, then great too because that light is soft and uniform and that suits my shooting style.

The ND filter only affects light intensity (attenuates or reduces it) but not the wavelengths of light. So no it won't affect color. My guess is that with that long exposure you got a color shift toward the green and this is just a property of the sensor because the red/green/blue pixels pick up light differently (have different sensitivities to light).

When I started out going out with my old film camera, I would pretend that I was working for National Geographic. I would pretend that I was on assignment, so that when I encountered something interesting, I had to really "report it". So, for example, I would go to a cemetary and shoot the statues and gravestones. I would go to the airport and shoot the taxis entering the front of it at sunset. I would go to a large wooden bridge and photograph it, then go back another day or time of day to try again. I would go into the countryside and shoot a farmer with his horses on a field. If there was a fashion show in town, I would go and shoot it as if I was on contract for Vogue, LOL. I photographed Prince Charles and Lady Di, the Queen of England, and Pope John Paul II, all just for fun. So even though the pictures were just for myself, they taught me a lot about how to approach a subject. Each subject and each photograph is an experiment, but it is also an expression. That is what makes photography so cool, that we can both do something technical with the medium, and pursue an art at the same time.

And sometimes I might come across something interesting not because of the subject itself but because of the way the light behaves with that subject. And then I will spend like an hour or even more just moving around the subject getting different angles until I am satisfied I "covered it" sufficiently well that I've exhausted all possibilities of capturing it. I'm very details oriented when I shoot. Learning to shoot is a lot like learning how to play a musical instrument. The more you practice, the more you learn about yourself and about what is going on inside you in terms of your own personal style, and that will then feed back into your playing, or your photography.
 
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