PP help needed for noisy photo

The shot is very underexposed so you are never going to get a great photo. Just not enough detail there. Here is the best I could do,

DSC_7145.jpg
 

Horoscope Fish

Senior Member
I've been trying to salvage this photo but seem to be chasing my tail. When I try to brighten it up and sharpen it, noise goes way up, and I'm unable to denoise it without making it overly soft. Would appreciate pro tips on cleaning up this image, if at all possible. Thanks in advance!
Below is the histogram of your shot. In short, that's not a lot of information, certainly not enough dynamic range, to work with successfully.
This is why getting exposure right in-camera is critical.
....
....
Bird Shot Histo.jpg

.....
 
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I've been trying to salvage this photo but seem to be chasing my tail. When I try to brighten it up and sharpen it, noise goes way up, and I'm unable to denoise it without making it overly soft. Would appreciate pro tips on cleaning up this image, if at all possible. Thanks in advance!

Here is a link to the RAW .NEF image: https://www.dropbox.com/s/mqrrykuwuqyz62b/DSC_7145.NEF?dl=0

Frigatebird by p.g.photo.graphy, on Flickr

Also you used a shutter speed of 1/6400 sec and that is much faster than needed. 1/2000 or 1/1500 sec is enough for Bird in flight most of the time. also with dark birds you generally need to over expose by at least a stop because of the bright sky.
 

hark

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I took a look at it, but the focus isn't very sharp. You can only sharpen an out of focus image so much. As Don mentioned, when you shoot into the sky, the meter will read the brightness of the sky and automatically underexpose the shot. So if what you are shooting is bright, go brighter with your exposure. When the scene is dark (and if you want to maintain the darkness) then go darker with your exposure. If you don't, the meter will lighten the exposure. Keep trying!
 

gustafson

Senior Member
Below is the histogram of your shot. In short, that's not a lot of information, certainly not enough dynamic range, to work with successfully.
This is why getting exposure right in-camera is critical.
....
....
View attachment 256685
.....

Thanks for the pointer. Looks like the peak on the left is the wings, and the peak on the right is the sky and the lighter part of the body. Does it mean anything that the peak on the right appears clipped?
 
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gustafson

Senior Member
I took a look at it, but the focus isn't very sharp. You can only sharpen an out of focus image so much. As Don mentioned, when you shoot into the sky, the meter will read the brightness of the sky and automatically underexpose the shot. So if what you are shooting is bright, go brighter with your exposure. When the scene is dark (and if you want to maintain the darkness) then go darker with your exposure. If you don't, the meter will lighten the exposure. Keep trying!

Good explanation. In retrospect, should have considered center-weighted metering.
 
For my BIF using my 150-600 I set it on manual at 1/1500 sec @ f8 and have the ISO set on Auto. I have exposure compensation set on + if I am shooting into the sky and can change that depending on the conditions.. Metering set on center-weighted at all times and the focus points generally on Single but that is more a personal thing. My D750 has a Group setting but the D7100 does not have that but the 9 point (I believe that is what the D7100 has) can be a good alternative.​




02-17-2017_0176-edit.jpg
 

hark

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For my BIF using my 150-600 I set it on manual at 1/1500 sec @ f8 and have the ISO set on Auto. I have exposure compensation set on + if I am shooting into the sky and can change that depending on the conditions.. Metering set on center-weighted at all times and the focus points generally on Single but that is more a personal thing. My D750 has a Group setting but the D7100 does not have that but the 9 point (I believe that is what the D7100 has) can be a good alternative.​





02-17-2017_0176-edit.jpg

I'm just looking for a quick explanation, Don, but I hope I don't derail this thread.

I don't shoot with Auto-ISO; however, with the ERR messages I am getting with my D750, I'm open to give it a try. So if I understand correctly, you are in Manual Mode (not Aperture or Shutter Priority)? You set your shutter speed and aperture manually, then the camera will set the ISO in between two values that you've chosen ahead of time? And when you use the +/- button, it will work in Manual mode when it usually doesn't? Is all of this correct? :confused:
 
I'm just looking for a quick explanation, Don, but I hope I don't derail this thread.

I don't shoot with Auto-ISO; however, with the ERR messages I am getting with my D750, I'm open to give it a try. So if I understand correctly, you are in Manual Mode (not Aperture or Shutter Priority)? You set your shutter speed and aperture manually, then the camera will set the ISO in between two values that you've chosen ahead of time? And when you use the +/- button, it will work in Manual mode when it usually doesn't? Is all of this correct? :confused:

Yes it is. In my opinion it is an elegant way to shoot. I want a certain shutter speed and at certain f stop that works for BIF With this kind of shooting the conditions can change between when you acquire the bird and when the bird goes out of range. You can't be fooling with buttons and settings during that time. It works for me anyway. I set the ISO at minimum 100 or 50 all the time and the maximum at 3200 most of the time. Sometimes it does have to be cranked up depending on the day.
 

hark

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Yes it is. In my opinion it is an elegant way to shoot. I want a certain shutter speed and at certain f stop that works for BIF With this kind of shooting the conditions can change between when you acquire the bird and when the bird goes out of range. You can't be fooling with buttons and settings during that time. It works for me anyway. I set the ISO at minimum 100 or 50 all the time and the maximum at 3200 most of the time. Sometimes it does have to be cranked up depending on the day.

Thanks, Don. I will definitely give Auto-ISO a try. When I'm in Aperture Priority, that's when I get the ERR with the very first shot. When I'm in Manual Mode, it hasn't happened. Auto-ISO sounds like changes could be made a little faster since I'd still be able to use the +/- button (which I LOVE when I'm in Aperture Priority). Thanks again.

Now back to the regularly scheduled programming of @gustafson 's thread PP help needed for noisy photo. ;)
 

Horoscope Fish

Senior Member
Thanks, Don. I will definitely give Auto-ISO a try. When I'm in Aperture Priority, that's when I get the ERR with the very first shot. When I'm in Manual Mode, it hasn't happened. Auto-ISO sounds like changes could be made a little faster since I'd still be able to use the +/- button (which I LOVE when I'm in Aperture Priority). Thanks again.

Now back to the regularly scheduled programming of @gustafson 's thread PP help needed for noisy photo. ;)
Sorry to barge in but I wanted to chime in on Don's post. Not only is using Auto-ISO in full Manual an "elegant" shooting method, to borrow Don's word, it's also, in my mind anyway, infinitely practical. If you'll permit me I will expound.

So... The Exposure Triangle: Shutter Speed, Aperture, ISO. Of these three things I concern myself the *least* with ISO; not that I disregard it totally, mind you, but really what's the big deal between say ISO 100 vs ISO 400 in the practical sense? What other option allows me FOUR full stops of adjustment without blowing the shot? Dropping down four stops of shutter speed? Doubtful. Opening up another four stops of aperture? Possible I suppose but it doesn't seem likely. Either of these options might work but it's certainly going to change the aesthetic of my shot and most likely, quite dramatically.

Okay, so yes; the eventual downside to cranking up the ISO is noise so maybe in some situations letting it go too high less than ideal but... Consider the alternatives: 1. Drop the shutter speed... Which could easily result in a blurry shot. 2. Open the aperture... Which results in a shallow DoF... Which could easily lead to a blurry shot. Are the results of either Option 1 or Option 2 recoverable in post-processing? Not so much; you can't Photoshop your way out of a blurry shot, as you already know. But digital noise we at least have tools to deal with, pretty good ones actually (e.g. Dfine from NIK). To my way of thinking the only "Negative Leg" of the Exposure Triangle I can recover from in post is the noise produced by too high an ISO. Typically it also has the least overall impact on the aesthetic of my shot.

As always, your mileage may vary.
 

Blacktop

Senior Member
Sorry to barge in but I wanted to chime in on Don's post. Not only is using Auto-ISO in full Manual an "elegant" shooting method, to borrow Don's word, it's also, in my mind anyway, infinitely practical. If you'll permit me I will expound.

So... The Exposure Triangle: Shutter Speed, Aperture, ISO. Of these three things I concern myself the *least* with ISO; not that I disregard it totally, mind you, but really what's the big deal between say ISO 100 vs ISO 400 in the practical sense? What other option allows me FOUR full stops of adjustment without blowing the shot? Dropping down four stops of shutter speed? Doubtful. Opening up another four stops of aperture? Possible I suppose but it doesn't seem likely. Either of these options might work but it's certainly going to change the aesthetic of my shot and most likely, quite dramatically.

Okay, so yes; the eventual downside to cranking up the ISO is noise so maybe in some situations letting it go too high less than ideal but... Consider the alternatives: 1. Drop the shutter speed... Which could easily result in a blurry shot. 2. Open the aperture... Which results in a shallow DoF... Which could easily lead to a blurry shot. Are the results of either Option 1 or Option 2 recoverable in post-processing? Not so much; you can't Photoshop your way out of a blurry shot, as you already know. But digital noise we at least have tools to deal with, pretty good ones actually (e.g. Dfine from NIK). To my way of thinking the only "Negative Leg" of the Exposure Triangle I can recover from in post is the noise produced by too high an ISO. Typically it also has the least overall impact on the aesthetic of my shot.

As always, your mileage may vary.

If I may make comment on #2 Most BIF shots are not close enough for that to matter. I shoot most of my BIF shots in f/5.6 because that is the maximum aperture of my lens. If I had a 500mm f/4, I would still be shooting it at maximum.
However there are a few times when I get to shoot close in and I wish I would have stopped down the aperture, but those times are pretty rare.

Another reason I like to shoot wide open these type of shots, it's because I prefer a smooth background. For me, there is nothing that ruins a nice BIF shot then a busy looking background.

If I may indulge. This shot here was taken pretty close up. I could have stopped down to get all the bird in focus, but I don't want to trade that for a background that is distracting to my eye..

_DSC4077-Edit.jpg


I could also have moved back some like in this next shot. Both at f/5.6, but with this second shot I have a lot more areas in focus on the bird and still getting a smooth background.

_DSC4050-Edit.jpg


I know this doesn't have much to do with the OP's original post, but I thought it might help him in his shooting if he ever comes across this situation.
 

nickt

Senior Member
I often shoot manual and auto iso. I don't bother to cap the iso, I'll take the grainy shot if that's all I can get. I programmed my pv and fn buttons on the camera front to center weighted and spot metering so I can instantly use them and not worry about forgetting to go back to matrix metering.
 

Blade Canyon

Senior Member
DSC_7145.jpg

Best I could get. I had to trick Photoshop to work on your NEF file. PS kept saying "wrong file type", but I was able to see the pic in Bridge, then open in Camera Raw, then to PS.
 

Blade Canyon

Senior Member
I don't remember exactly right now, but in Camera Raw it was probably just moving the exposure, contrast, highlights, shadows, white, and black sliders. Noise reduction was a Nik Collection (free!) tool.
 
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