Photographing paintings

slsl6

Senior Member
I'm still using my old D70s with the 28-105 kit lens. I've been trying to get good photos of oil paintings and have had no luck. Granted I'm a lousy photographer, and it's a kit lens, and I need to work on my lighting, but the photos I've taken (both RAW and jpeg) look horrible compared to the actual paintings. Someone has recommended the AF-S Micro-Nikkor 60mm f/2.8 ED for this purpose, which i would look for used. Would this lens help me out?

Thanks in advance!
 

TwistedThrottle

Senior Member
@slsl6
I have no experience shooting oil paintings, so I cant comment on that. What do you typically zoom to in order to take your images? What do you mean by, "look horrible"? Some example images might help determine what can be done to help you out.
I love macro lenses, they're some of the sharpest optics out there. They also have their limitations though. If you do not have the ability to zoom with your feet, the zoom lens you have might be better for your needs. Also, when you mount a 60mm lens on your D70s, the effective focal length would be 90mm. Great for getting close to shoot the details of the swirl marks made by the brush, not so great if you don't have the space to move back far enough to get what you want in the shot.
I might suggest a 35 f1.8 rather than the macro. This will give you a focal length combined with your crop sensor similar to what we see with our eyes and will allow you to shoot in lower light situations, (museums) due to the larger aperture.
You can also work with the camera and lens you have by using a tripod, slowing the shutter speed down to allow more light to the sensor and adjusting the aperture to f8 to get the sharpest image all while keeping the ISO as low as possible. for indoor low light shots, try 1 second, f8 ISO 200. If its too dark, slow the shutter more. You will want to use a shutter release cable or the camera's timer to eliminate the shake created by pressing the shutter release button and a stable tripod is essential for slow shutter speeds. Bonus points for using a speedlight with a diffuser but flash isn't always allowed.
 
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lucien

Senior Member
I have a few samples that I took at the Art Gallery of Ontario. They tend to come out better in black and white. And this wasn't with an Nikon but I don't see why any decent dslr can't reproduce the results. I'm not saying they are the greatest either but some samples

IMGP4966_DxO.jpg
 

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lucien

Senior Member
I hope I didn't break any copyright infringements. No lolz

serious note: you can get a little closer to get rid of the frames instead of cropping out your images. And you need a fairly fast lens. I used a Tamron af 17-50mm 1:2.8 non vr. It just takes practice and your cam should have decent low light capabilities. 3200 shouldn't be a problem noise wise.
 
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lucien

Senior Member
and correct never fails, an old saying, that's what I meant by ISO 3,200 shouldn't be a problem.
 
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Fred Kingston

Senior Member
The Nikkor 60mm 2.8D would be the quintessential lens for what you want to do. It was Nikon's solution for manuscript photography and gives a perfect 1:1 image with as good as you can get lens performance from edge to edge... YOUR problem is going to be lighting. In a studio type environment, you can control all aspects of the lighting and positioning... In a museum setting, all bets are off... In fact, many museums get anxious if they even see you with a camera...
 

hark

Administrator
Staff member
Super Mod
Contributor
I am assuming you are shooting with ambient light and not any type of flash or strobe. The problem with flash/strobe is the possibility of hot spots showing up on the paint. When shooting in ambient conditions (no supplemental lighting), keep in mind whatever type of lighting is used where the paintings are hanging whether tungsten or fluorescent, there may very well be a color cast issue - which means you need to set your white balance either before shooting or correct the white balance in whatever software you use for post processing.

Generally a prime lens will be sharper than a kit zoom. Shoot with a tripod if possible to keep your ISO down, and either use a remote release or the self-timer so the camera doesn't move due to pressing the shutter button. And try to frame up the paintings by keeping the vertical and horizontal edges of the paintings straight.
 

lucien

Senior Member
The Nikkor 60mm 2.8D would be the quintessential lens for what you want to do. It was Nikon's solution for manuscript photography and gives a perfect 1:1 image with as good as you can get lens performance from edge to edge... YOUR problem is going to be lighting. In a studio type environment, you can control all aspects of the lighting and positioning... In a museum setting, all bets are off... In fact, many museums get anxious if they even see you with a camera...

Would he need a flash with that lens? If so that's even more dismal for museum settings
 

slsl6

Senior Member
The painting in question is 30x40 inches, so I have to be farther back to get it all in. Would a 50 or 60mm prime work for this? Same question for, say, a 24x36?
 

hark

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The painting in question is 30x40 inches, so I have to be farther back to get it all in. Would a 50 or 60mm prime work for this? Same question for, say, a 24x36?

How much room do you have to move back? I'd think a 50mm would work fine if there is enough distance between the camera and the paintings. Allow a little bit of room around the edges of your frame to avoid any type of distortion. In all honesty, for paintings that large, I'm not sure you'd need a macro although they tend to be really sharp lenses. But even a 50mm f/1.8 (with a hood to prevent any stray light from entering your lens) should work fine. It would be best to stop down to perhaps f/5.6 since that's kind of a sweet spot for a fast lens. If there is any kind of depth such as a deep frame, then perhaps f/8 or f/9.
 

TwistedThrottle

Senior Member
The painting in question is 30x40 inches, so I have to be farther back to get it all in. Would a 50 or 60mm prime work for this? Same question for, say, a 24x36?
Use the zoom lens you have to determine what focal length works best for you. Just set it to 60 or 50 or 35 and that's what a 60, 50 and a 35mm prime lens would look like, just with better optics. Keep in mind minimum focus distances. You have to be at least a couple feet away with the 35 and 50, similar to your zoom. The 60mm macro lens allows you to get within inches, making whatever you have the lens pointed at appear huge (and sharp!) in the frame.
 

Fred Kingston

Senior Member
Would he need a flash with that lens? If so that's even more dismal for museum settings

A flash would be helpful, but there are so many variables that we don't know about. Museums panic when they see/hear about a flash. If he can't use a flash, then he'll have to shoot with a tripod... again, it all depends on the available lighting. His post raises more questions than answers.

Is this a one off project, or an on-going project to shoot many paintings? Are these in museums? Are these paintings out in the open, or behind glass barriers? What kind of lighting is available? Can a tripod and flash be used? Are these available to use? What sounds simple on the surface can be complicated based on the details.

He says he tried this already and wasn't happy with the result. What were the results? What was the issue? Too dark? Wrong colors? Glare? Wrong focal length/composition?
 

slsl6

Senior Member
The problem with my attempts is that the results don't capture of effect of the painting at all, the colors are muddy or wrong, details are lost, the colors in various layers of paint are separated, etc. if you look at the actual painting and then at the photo, it's night and day. Now this is a complaint I've heard from many artists, but when i visit various artists' websites, they all have really great photos with none of the issues that I'm experiencing. Granted, I'm not a pro photographer and don't have pro equipment, so...

Here's a photo of a painting that came out O.K. (taken with the d70s kit lens)--it's no doubt a bit underexposed but I like it this way and it's grainy, probably due to lower light.
 

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TwistedThrottle

Senior Member
You can try to mess with the RAW file in photoshop or lightroom, but there's only so far it'll go. There have been major advancements in sensor technology since 2005. You can continue to take pictures in good light and get good results, but expecting technology that's so old to keep up with what's available today might be asking too much from your gear, especially with a demand such as this of low light and dark colors. I'm not sure a new lens is going to be the fix for you without the ability to also add more light. It might be time to start saving up for a new body with a better sensor that's capable of higher ISO values. I am very happy with my D7500, I think your D70s is like the great great grandfather to it. You can snag a refurbished body for a reasonable price and I think it would help with your needs. Even that camera is not the newest technology and I can see a difference in the photos taken with that vs. the new Z cameras. If it's in your budget, those Z's are stellar for exactly this kind of photography. I ended up with the full frame Z6, but have heard awesome things about the crop sensor Z50(same sensor as the D7500). All 3 of these bodies mentioned have tremendous ISO capabilities.
 
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lucien

Senior Member
You can try to mess with the RAW file in photoshop or lightroom, but there's only so far it'll go. There have been major advancements in sensor technology since 2005. You can continue to take pictures in good light and get good results, but expecting technology that's so old to keep up with what's available today might be asking too much from your gear, especially with a demand such as this of low light and dark colors. I'm not sure a new lens is going to be the fix for you without the ability to also add more light. It might be time to start saving up for a new body with a better sensor that's capable of higher ISO values. I am very happy with my D7500, I think your D70s is like the great great grandfather to it. You can snag a refurbished body for a reasonable price and I think it would help with your needs. Even that camera is not the newest technology and I can see a difference in the photos taken with that vs. the new Z cameras. If it's in your budget, those Z's are stellar for exactly this kind of photography. I ended up with the full frame Z6, but have heard awesome things about the crop sensor Z50(same sensor as the D7500). All 3 of these bodies mentioned have tremendous ISO capabilities.

I concur wholeheartedly
 

slsl6

Senior Member
Yes, I thought I'd try shooting in a room with a big window letting natural light in. 200 ISO, tripod, timed release of shutter.
 
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