+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 35
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Challenge Team
    cwgrizz's Avatar

    EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    Just about the time I think I am getting a grasp on the EV +/- compensation concept, I seem to develop a fog in the brain. Ha! I have read and watched videos to explain how the camera works with the exposure and the gray/grey figure, etc. For me common sense seems that if I have a very bright scene ie washed out bright sky, I would want to shift the exposure to the negative, or if I have a dark forest scene that I would want to brighten it up with a plus compensation. I know that I read that the camera sees the bright scene a compensates by moving what it thinks the gray point would be up on the scale and thus underexposing the shot so the rule is to go plus with the EV.

    For me, I have not seen that work out. For the sake of illustration the bright sky scenario, when in Shutter Priority mode, 0 EV compensation the aperture is f9.0. Put in a +1 EV and the aperture opens (fstop decreases in number) which blows the sky scene out more. This is where I can't wrap my head around the written things I have read ie "Bright, go brighter" and "Dark go darker". Bright is the white sand or snow example I see most.

    Saying all of this, I do seem to have better results with BIF by setting the EV +0.7 or so. The sky ends up blown out, but the bird is not just a black bird shaped blot.

    I have been leaning toward the idea of ............... I don't know how I am leaning on this now. Ha! Please help me shape this in my mind with examples. Something that you may use for a rule on particular types of shots ie small dark bird in birght sky, light object in a dark woods, all dark, all bright...

    Thanks, I really think I just have a mental block (happens when you get old, no wait, it happened when I was young too.)


    › See More: EV Compensation -- I should know... but
    Thanks/Like Lawrence Thanks/liked this post
     
    Walt

    D750; D7100; D5300;
    18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 G II VR; AF-S VR 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 G IF-ED; AF-S 85mm f1.8; Tokina 11-16mm f2.8 (IF) DX II; 200-500mm f5.6E ED VR; AF-S VR 24-120mm f/4G ED; TC14E II





  2. #2
    Senior Member
    FredKingston's Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    Wouldn't it just be easier to put the camera in manual mode, and not worry about EC???
    Thanks/Like cwgrizz Thanks/liked this post
     

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Challenge Team
    cwgrizz's Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    Yes @FredKingston that would be OK if the shooting scenario was always the same, but with what I seem to be shooting most (BIF) it can be in many different directions and conditions. Clouds, bright sky, trees etc for backgrounds thus creating different lighting. I usually shoot "S" priority for BIF with a shutter speed of 1250 or 1600. The sky can vary extremely in the brightness, but it is still too bright for the dark birds. ISO is fixed, Shutter speed is fixed, so fStop is all that changes. The EV biases the aperture, but still lets it change for brightness. It is not a situation where I can shoot, look at results, adjust and shoot again. If I could do that then Manual would be the way to go.

    And then there is the question, why have EV compensation on the camera if you don't use it. Ha! Again, I am just trying to comprehend how to use it because it is there.
    Walt

    D750; D7100; D5300;
    18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 G II VR; AF-S VR 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 G IF-ED; AF-S 85mm f1.8; Tokina 11-16mm f2.8 (IF) DX II; 200-500mm f5.6E ED VR; AF-S VR 24-120mm f/4G ED; TC14E II



  4. #4
    Senior Member
    John!'s Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    It can be confusing I know, Maybe I can help.
    Your camera meter does not know whether you are shooting a snow scene or a pile of coal. therefor it will try to expose every scene to an average of 18% grey.
    Lets say you are shooting a snowy owl on a bright day with snow covered ground. This scene would be a lot brighter than than the average scene. To compensate for the bright scene you tell your camera that to overexpose by at least 1 stop, maybe even 1 2/3. Thats where the EV +1 comes from. Of course with the dark pile of coal every thing is just reversed.
    By default the cameras meter will try to expose both scenes to be the same bright.

    Hope this helps..

    John
    Thanks/Like cwgrizz Thanks/liked this post
     
    "The single most important component of a camera is the twelve inches behind it." - Ansel Adams

    My Flickr Page
    My 500px

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Challenge Team
    cwgrizz's Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    @John! Thanks, I know what you are saying. That is what I have read and watched someone in videos explain. In words and on paper it makes perfect sense. I completely understand what is being said, but........ where I am having problems is that I cannot seem to put it to practice. In other words, it doesn't seem to work as is being stated. Of course, I don't have a snow covered scene (So AZ doesn't get many snow storms. Ha!)

    Let me put it another way. I can take a picture of the extra bright sky with the exposure as the camera decides it should be (no EV compensation) Shutter priority, ISO fixed, and the camera sets the aperture as an example of f9. The shot is not underexposed as stated it will be in all of the tutorials on EV compensation (because the 18% grey is guessed by the camera to be averaged), but in my estimation quite the opposite and overexposed. Of course in this situation if you add +1,2 or anything + it just exacerbates the overexposure.

    Maybe I am still missing when to use or compensate. I know I can take three photos of the same scene using EV 0, +1, -1 and see the results as expected. +1 brighter, -1 darker from what 0 showed. If using something similar to the black coal (a line of thick pine trees) the exposure at 0 is dark (shadowed) so if I add -1 it just gets darker, but contrary to the 18% grey concept +1 pulls out the detail.

    I hope this helps to illustrate my confusion and maybe give someone something that I am missing and bring my brain exposure to the correct value. Ha!

    Thanks to all.
    Last edited by cwgrizz; 10-29-2015 at 07:41 AM.
    Walt

    D750; D7100; D5300;
    18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 G II VR; AF-S VR 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 G IF-ED; AF-S 85mm f1.8; Tokina 11-16mm f2.8 (IF) DX II; 200-500mm f5.6E ED VR; AF-S VR 24-120mm f/4G ED; TC14E II



  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Challenge Team
    cwgrizz's Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    I see people using it, but the photographed scenes (for me) are hard to determine why they put in -0.33 or something. Post processing can throw the "look at the picture and determine why EV compensation was used" out the window.
    Walt

    D750; D7100; D5300;
    18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 G II VR; AF-S VR 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 G IF-ED; AF-S 85mm f1.8; Tokina 11-16mm f2.8 (IF) DX II; 200-500mm f5.6E ED VR; AF-S VR 24-120mm f/4G ED; TC14E II



  7. #7
    Senior Member
    mikew's Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    I put -0.33 in because auto ISO tends to over expose,as you say it would be easy in post but just as easy in camera.
    Mike

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/7239177@N07/

    Nikon D500, Sigma 100-400, Sigma 105 macro, Nikon 18-200

    Nikon 1 V2,FT-1,10-30mm 30-110mm Viltrox extension tubes










  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Michael J.'s Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    I need for my 55-300 -3 for my other lenses only on bright days, sunset I go for -7 or higher, Night photography too. Makes the scene more how I see it
    Michael J.
    Camera: Nikon D7200
    Lenses: Tamron 70-300mm F4-5.6 Di VC USD A030, SIGMA 17-50 mm. f 2.8


    Don't get confused between my personality and my attitude. My personality is who I am, my attitude depends on who you are.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Horoscope Fish's Avatar

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    Quote Originally Posted by cwgrizz View Post
    Let me put it another way. I can take a picture of the extra bright sky with the exposure as the camera decides it should be (no EV compensation) Shutter priority, ISO fixed, and the camera sets the aperture as an example of f9. The shot is not underexposed as stated it will be in all of the tutorials on EV compensation (because the 18% grey is guessed by the camera to be averaged), but in my estimation quite the opposite and overexposed. Of course in this situation if you add +1,2 or anything + it just exacerbates the overexposure.
    Okay so let me use an example to make sure I understand what's going on. You are using Shutter Priority so your shutter speed is dialed in to something like 1/500 (just as an example). Your preferred ISO is also dialed in to, say, ISO 200 (or whatever). Exposure Compensation is at "0". You point your camera at a very bright sky, the camera selects f/9 as the aperture and you take the shot. You review the shot and it's over-exposed. If that's what's happening then I'd have to say something is not adding up.

    To help people remember how to use Exposure Compensation, I tell them, "If it's too bright, go brighter (use +EV). If it's too dark, go darker (use -EV).

    The only thing I can think of that might be fouling up this equation is Matrix Metering. Is that what you use primarily? If so, try doing some test shots using other metering modes and see if your experience with Exposure Compensation is the same. Simply put, +EV should be doing just that, giving you a a brighter exposure; while -EV should be giving you a darker exposure. From what you are describing however, this is not the case and we need to figure out why.
    ....
    ~ Paul
    ....
    ....
    Primary Kit :: D750 (OLPF Removed), MB-D10; Tamron 70-200mm f/2.8 Di VC USD G2, Sigma 135mm f/1.8 Art, Sigma 50mm f/1.4 Art,
    Godox Flashes & Triggers, Manfrotto X055PROB, 3-Legged Thing Airhed II... All Stuffed into a Manfrotto Pro Backpack 50
    ....
    ....
    ● ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ ๑۩۩๑ ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ ●

  10. #10
    Senior Member

    Re: EV Compensation -- I should know... but

    I'm getting confused here, just on the wording of the tip. I do understand how the compensation works. I've never really heard it put like that, but let me see if I follow the logic... This tip works out if the scene is generally bright AND the subject will get 'lost in the sauce'. That is, because of the generally bright scene, the main subject will get darkened up by the meter, possibly too much. So for bright scene, go + works. Or maybe a snow scene. Snow will certainly look gray, so + would whiten it up. That fits the tip too.

    But I always thought of exposure compensation this way:
    Positive compensation gives more exposure than the meter suggests. Negative compensation gives less exposure than the meter suggests. With that in mind, how will my main subject meter? Will he end up too dark because of bright surroundings fooling my meter? If so + compensation added. The tip is confusing because we have bright scene, but dark main subject. Example would be a bird in the sky or kids on the beach with sun behind them. Bright sky - dark bird, therefore + compensation.
    Example 2 is a white cat cat sitting in a shady tree. White cat will get blown out when the meter balances the scene and brightens up the tree. So minus compensation added in for the bright cat.

    In the two examples above, the 'important' things could reverse by personal choice. Maybe we want the clouds exposed, not the bird flying by. Maybe we want the tree leaves shown at their best, not the white cat.

    Then there is another possibility that doesn't fit the tip... Do we simply want to lighten or darken the whole scene? For an extreme instance do we want to make a day scene look darker or a night scene look brighter? Simply add compensation for a dark scene to make it brighter or subtract exposure from a bright scene to make it look darker.

    The bottom line question for my brain is "do I want the area of the scene that I am most interested in to have more exposure or less exposure?" Then I will just add or subtract compensation accordingly. The tip just doesn't work for me, but sometimes my brain is stubborn to follow the conventional path even though I end up in the right place. I'm more good with saying dark subject then add compensation. Bright/blown subject, remove compensation.

    I hope I didn't confuse more.
    I must have a really good camera.





Quick Reply Quick Reply

If you are already a member, please login above before posting.

Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •