Refurb 1.7x TC & 300mm PF

hark

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For the past few months, I've mentioned how my refurbished 1.7x TC coupled with my 300mm f/4 PF was stellar until I removed the TC from my camera before being put back on. Then suddenly my images missed focus - mostly being soft and slightly out of focus. And there was some front focusing going on that never used to happen with this combo.

With all my lenses, I always use the Sport VR option when it is available. After having elbow surgery many years ago, I've found it to be superior to the Normal VR (but that's only due to *my* physical limitations). On every lens, Sport VR has been sharper. When shooting with the lens only (no 1.7x TC), Sport VR is fine. But I've noticed now with the 1.7x TC and Sport VR, most of my images miss focus or simply are soft. And that's been consistent ever since I initially removed the TC then put it back on. However, I don't know if the problem has to do with the TC or the lens. Again, the lens alone with Sport VR is exceptionally sharp.

So here are several images from today. NONE of these have been post processed. All were NEF's opened in Camera RAW. Lens Profile was selected, all only have the default sharpening (40 I think) but no noise reduction. All are Adobe Color for the profile. Then all were taken to PCC where they were resized for the forum. No cropping to any of them.

I'm pretty sure these first two were taken with Sport VR. Both are soft or possibly heavily front focused.

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So I switched to Normal VR. Okay - not bad as there is quite a bit of feather detail visible. :)

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This 300mm f/4 PF was purchased as preowned. Since I always use Sport VR, I hadn't tested out the Normal VR. One of the problems with the lens (and it happens without any TC), is the image jumps to a new position within my viewfinder - but ONLY with Normal VR. Take a look at these 3 successive images and note how the subject isn't in the same place. But that is a lens issue and has nothing to do with the TC. It drives me nuts! :beguiled: But overall, the feather detail is still very nice. :encouragement: I stuck with Normal VR for the remainder of my images.

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But I still wind up with one every once in a while being slightly soft even with Normal VR. :(

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But for the most part I can get some great detail such as these two.

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But then this one wound up being soft - and that was with a shutter speed of 1/2000". Possibly the camera hadn't achieved focus since the subject is dark. Keep in mind wide open with the 1.7x TC, my aperture is f/6.7. So possibly that might have caused this focus glitch. I'm looking for any suggestions to try to help isolate the focus problems vs. VR problem. I also want to test out this 1.7x TC with my 70-200mm f/4 VR lens to isolate any problems that might be related specifically to the TC or determine if some problems are related to the 300mm f/4 PF lens. Comments and suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks! :)

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Whiskeyman

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If the problem was consistent, I'd suggest that you check your AF Fine Tune settings. Since your results are not consistent, I'll wager that is not the problem. Can you mount the camera on a tripod and take multiple photos of a stationary subject with various VR modes and with the VR turned off? Do this with both AF on and using manual focus to see if the issue still remains. Let us know the results if you are able to do this.

WM
 

hark

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If the problem was consistent, I'd suggest that you check your AF Fine Tune settings. Since your results are not consistent, I'll wager that is not the problem. Can you mount the camera on a tripod and take multiple photos of a stationary subject with various VR modes and with the VR turned off? Do this with both AF on and using manual focus to see if the issue still remains. Let us know the results if you are able to do this.

WM

Sure, I can do that. Thanks for the suggestion, WM.
 

hark

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Here are two that I decided to process.

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With the one below, I hit my ISO cap of 4000 because my shutter speed was so high. At times when the ducks were preening, their heads moved pretty fast. This one was in total shade, too. I wound up having to raise my exposure in post processing to compensate.

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Whiskeyman

Senior Member
Here are two that I decided to process.



With the one below, I hit my ISO cap of 4000 because my shutter speed was so high. At times when the ducks were preening, their heads moved pretty fast. This one was in total shade, too. I wound up having to raise my exposure in post processing to compensate.

Those photos look like they are larger than real-life size. I wouldn't expect them to be tack aharp.

I do see some good detail in some of the lower photo's feathers. I also believe that there is also motion blur in the upper photo that is causing issues. Are these non-cropped photos?

WM
 
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hark

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Those photos look like they are larger than real-life size. I wouldn't expect them to be tack aharp.

I do see some good detail in some of the lower photo's feathers. I also believe that there is also motion blue in the upper photo that is causing issues. Are these non-cropped photos?

WM

The first image is a 4x5 crop - mostly taken off the left and only a tiny bit off the bottom. So overall, only a small crop to the bird at the bottom. The second image isn't cropped at all. I was very close to them which is why they filled my frame so much.
 

Needa

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How goes the search for answers? After doing some research on VR, AF and TCs its as clear a mud for me. With a TC it is referensed as available focus points at F8 usually cross type, so what happens at F9?

Example d500 focus point chart.

https://nps.nikonimaging.com/technical_solutions/d500_tips/af/focus_points/#cross-sensors

Some sources indicate VR is not require above a SS of 1/500 and some seem to think VR could actually move the image off the focus point. So are there any source of information in your experience that are reliable?
 

hark

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How goes the search for answers? After doing some research on VR, AF and TCs its as clear a mud for me. With a TC it is referensed as available focus points at F8 usually cross type, so what happens at F9?

Example d500 focus point chart.

https://nps.nikonimaging.com/technical_solutions/d500_tips/af/focus_points/#cross-sensors

Some sources indicate VR is not require above a SS of 1/500 and some seem to think VR could actually move the image off the focus point. So are there any source of information in your experience that are reliable?

Thanks for this info. I haven't had time over the past couple of days (and probably won't today) to continue to search for answers. But one thing I've noticed is when I use the Sport VR, the image doesn't get locked (or stilled) when I do a half-press. There is still movement visible that I am not holding the camera/lens steady. So I want to put the TC on my 70-200mm f/4 and see if it does the same thing. If it doesn't happen with that lens, then most likely the issue is with the 300mm's Sport VR option and not the TC.
 

hark

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All I can say is I really missed this opportunity. :mad: Knowing wildlife is hard to find during our heatwave, I went in search of geese armed with a different 1.7x Nikon TC. Geese happen to be the only wildlife I see when it is so darned hot.

So I saw a bird flying overhead with a white head. Initially I thought it was a seagull. :shame: Bad judgement call on my part for sure. ;) Bird changed direction. Darned. It was a Bald Eagle. Sheesh. Grabbed my camera from the seat beside me which was set with 1/1000" shutter speed and Sport VR, then started shooting. :beguiled: Then suddenly I realized my shutter speed was too slow. What follows is a sequence of jpegs since I shoot NEF and jpeg Large - only resized the jpegs for the forum. No need to edit the NEF's because I missed everything. Being honest here....:( What a PITA to work thru the possible options of what's wrong. :crushed:

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Changed my shutter speed as soon as I realized it was too slow - set to 1/2000" to reflect a flying bird. Still missed it so not sure if it is the TC (although it's a different 1.7x TC) or the lens. :( Realistically still missed the shots as it flew further and further away. :sorrow:

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hark

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So I've used the 300mm PF and the refurbished 1.7x TC with lackluster results. The Normal VR appears to be better than the Sport VR. I also used the lens with a new 1.7x TC with basically the same results. Sometimes the AF is off - front focusing - no matter which TC I use. But Sport VR mostly misses despite the fact that it used to be perfect.

Today I mounted the refurbished 1.7x TC on my D750 and 70-200mm f/4 VR lens. I also used it with Sport VR. Everything looks to be in focus with no blur. So I'm assuming it is the lens that is causing my problem. I purchased the lens as preowned. :(

Just for fun I might mount this TC on my D500 with my 300mm f/4 non-VR (AF-S) lens and see if it plays nice. ;) Am assuming it will based on what I've found out so far.

What I do know is the VR of this 300mm f/4 PF has issues. When using it with Normal VR, it's always moved the image up or down in my viewfinder after the image is taken. And that shouldn't happen. But the AF is off with the TC (front focusing). The lens by itself is stellar which is what I don't understand even when using Sport VR. :indecisiveness:
 

Needa

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Sorry to hear that your 300mm PF has AF problems. As it was preowned any chance you can exchange or get a refund?
 

hark

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Sorry to hear that your 300mm PF has AF problems. As it was preowned any chance you can exchange or get a refund?

My thoughts, also. Hopefully, it is possible.

WM

No. I've had it for almost 2.5 years. It didn't have any issues until I removed it along with the 1.7x TC earlier this year. But I do remember finding out the Normal VR had the issue of the image jumping inside the viewfinder. Since I don't use Normal VR, that didn't bother me - but I hadn't checked it when I first got it so only found out about it much later.
 

Needa

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Challenge Team
After thought.

Anyone troubleshooting AF and VR issues should clean all contacts and and mount surfaces as a first step. These contacts supply both information to and from the lens and also the power to perform these operations. I use and old microfiber towel with several drops of deoxit and keep it in a separate labelled bag. Added bonus is how smooth the lenses mount. Also for AF issue a cleaning of the body may be in order.
 

hark

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Re: After thought.

Anyone troubleshooting AF and VR issues should clean all contacts and and mount surfaces as a first step. These contacts supply both information to and from the lens and also the power to perform these operations. I use and old microfiber towel with several drops of deoxit and keep it in a separate labelled bag. Added bonus is how smooth the lenses mount. Also for AF issue a cleaning of the body may be in order.

Thanks - that was one of the first things I did when the issue started to happen. It's a good reminder especially for those who aren't aware. :encouragement:
 

Needa

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Re: After thought.

Thanks - that was one of the first things I did when the issue started to happen. It's a good reminder especially for those who aren't aware. :encouragement:

I thought you would have and that was my intent.
 

hark

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Today I went out with my previous 300mm f/4 AF-S (non-VR) and the refurbished 1.7x TC. I increased my shutter speed since this combo is both longer and a decent amount heavier. Both images were taken from the seat of my SUV.

Most of the images were pretty good. A couple were slightly soft - but this combo is heavier, and I have a chronic issue with trigger thumb and trigger finger in my right hand. Overall, I am still leaning towards it being the 300mm f/4 PF lens. But I want to narrow down whether it is just the Sport VR or if the AF is also a tad off.

At least I didn't have to use Shake Reduction which was becoming common with the 300mm PF.

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hark

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The jury is still out on my refurbished 1.7x TC and 300mm f/4 PF lens. Yesterday's outing with the non-VR 300mm coupled with the TC went well but was very heavy for the tendonitis in my hand. So last night I pulled out the 300mm f/4 PF once again. Back when I inspected both the TC and the lens, I cleaned the contacts first by using a rocket blower, then an eraser, then a microfiber cloth. Nothing changed.

Last night when I pulled out the lens, once again I inspected the contacts. This time there were a few very short pieces of fibers somehow attached to one of the contacts. They must have gotten loose when the lens was removed from the TC. But they weren't completely loose - they were caught around the base of the one contact. Carefully I removed them and became hopeful that maybe something would change. @Needa will be proud! Lol.

So today I photographed more geese. First couple of images were without VR. All images today had a shutter speed of 1/1600". Not bad on the non-VR pics. Then I switched it to Normal VR. Much to my surprise, the consecutive images didn't jump in the viewfinder like they did every time in the past since I've owned this lens. ::what:: Wow, that surprised me.

Then I switched it to Sport VR. Scrutinizing those on my PC, almost every one of them is in focus with just a few being the slightest bit soft (am attributing those to AF-C because I've always had a few that weren't totally sharp). :cool: But those slightly soft ones certainly were nothing like I was getting when this problem began. More testing will be done - tomorrow looks to be a decent day weather-wise. Today they called for rain but was only overcast while I was out.

The real test will be putting my shutter speed back down to 1/1000". Staying hopeful! :encouragement:
 
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