The meaning of D7500

pforsell

Senior Member
After pondering about the feature mix that Nikon decided on the D7500, I have made two conclusions. First, the dropping the AI-indexing tab, battery grip and and the second card slot seems to mean that there will be a successor to the D500. There needs to be one DX body fitted with all the features the public sees as "pro".

And since the D7500 is getting closer to the D5600 with the removal of the above features, and with the added tilt screen, I severely doubt whether the D5600 will have a successor. Sure, Nikon could name the next in line D3000-series camera D5700 no problem, but its feature set will be that of the D3000-series. They did the same thing with D600-series when they decided to name the D620 into D750 instead.

So the Nikon camera lineup is now D5, D810, D750, D500, D7500 and D3400. Three FX and three DX. All the other models are discontinued, but unfortunately for Nikon, thousands upon thousands of them lie in warehouses unsold. I think the Df was a one-off thing which is also discontinued long ago.

Nikon manufactures cameras in batches and we can be assured they will not re-tool their assembly lines to make another run of D7100 or D7200 despite those being still in price lists. Nikon has too much of those, no need to make any more.
 
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STM

Senior Member
It is dismaying that they dropped the AI indexing ring around the mount, they are pulling a Canon; though they are not changing the mount to the point that Canon did, they are abandoning the ability of their newest camera to utilize a lot of outstanding lenses that are coupled to the meter. I know that there are many models which lack this feature, but the primary reason I retired my D300 for the D7100 was this very feature. All of my Nikkor lenses (23 in all ::what::) are AI and AIS and I see no AF lenses in my future.
 

Leif

Senior Member
It is dismaying that they dropped the AI indexing ring around the mount, they are pulling a Canon; though they are not changing the mount to the point that Canon did, they are abandoning the ability of their newest camera to utilize a lot of outstanding lenses that are coupled to the meter. I know that there are many models which lack this feature, but the primary reason I retired my D300 for the D7100 was this very feature. All of my Nikkor lenses (23 in all ::what::) are AI and AIS and I see no AF lenses in my future.

I don't doubt that there are a lot of forum users who like you have lots of manual focus lenses. But, if we look at actual buyers of the D7200 for example, how many value such lenses? I have a couple, but the IQ is no match for modern lenses, which have better optical designs and coatings. The 200mm F4 AIS micro that I sold was mediocre at best, the 75-150mm F3.5 zoom has low contrast, the 28mm F2.8 AIS has a weird colour cast though it is sharp.

Can you give me a minute head start, so I can get away please, I'm not a fast runner? Oh blimey, there's a whole long line of people running after me, carrying pitch forks, and burning torches and chanting "Burn the witch", it's only a camera folks ... :)

Of course I might be wrong about the importance of manual lens compatibility, so it would be nice to have some solid evidence (for either view) rather than opinion.
 

STM

Senior Member
I have a couple, but the IQ is no match for modern lenses, which have better optical designs and coatings.

Look at the images in my gallery. Your assessment about the old AIS lenses is to a great extent incorrect and misinformed. The lenses you named are but a very small sampling of a very large assortment of some truly very fine lenses and those were not high performers for their day either. There are a lot of modern Nikkors which are dogs too and mechanically they are a world apart when it comes to the quality of the AI's and AIS's. Would it surprise you that many "modern" lenses are just AIS optical formulas that have been converted to AF?
 

Samo

Senior Member
This is something I have been wondering about myself. Will this not make the new camera much like the old 3000/5000 series models where they will mount nearly all F mount lenses but they will not meter them? If that is true big whoop just break out a light meter or sunny 16. I shoot a Df (a D700, and a D300S lets not even start on film equipment) and I own a huge pile of pre Ai, Ai, and Ais lenses. For what I shoot and as long as I have been shooting I really don't use the in camera meter and haven't for several years now. I just watch my histograms if need be and my exposures tend to be spot on or within range for post production correction.

First they gelded them and now this. From what I have read recently and if it is indeed true they are getting ready to release a whole line up of mirrorless cameras all out at once I am thinking they may indeed be going Canon and changing mounts. Nikon themselves have said they are going to be doing some major changes so maybe this is a hint of what direction they are going. If so whatever they come up with best be better than peaches and cream because if they radically change the F mount they will make many people very upset.

I tend to concur with STM on Ai and Ais lens performance compared to modern formulas. Many are the same formulas and optics dressed differently and in plastic! Oh no! LOL However some of the newer designs are better/superior...on newer bodies with big pixel counts. The problem I have with those versus old stuff is they are so sterile and lifeless looking at least to me but I know micro contrast and all of that is the latest and greatest fashion in the camera world. I can put a G lens on my Df and get some great stuff but it doesn't have the life like pop that some of the D lenses or older glass does. Those aberrations and flaws give pictures a certain character. Personally I think it has a lot to do pixel count but honestly I cant really put my finger on it with any certainty.

@STM I have looked at many of your posts. Of all the people on here you would be the one guy I think would have a Df. I cannot believe that you do not. You must rent one for a couple weeks because it is a weird camera. At first you will be like meh then after a while you will be I cannot believe I did not buy one of these yesterday.
 
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STM

Senior Member
@STM I have looked at many of your posts. Of all the people on here you would be the one guy I think would have a Df. I cannot believe that you do not. You must rent one for a couple weeks because it is a weird camera. At first you will be like meh then after a while you will be I cannot believe I did not buy one of these yesterday.

I have looked at them but to be honest for the kind of work I do I do not see enough of a difference to change. And it does come up short on the top end of shutter speeds and Nikon does not offer a battery grip for it. I will not spend that kind of money and put an inexpensive third party grip on it. If I am going to one day upgrade the D700 it most likely be with a D3X. There are still a lot of them out there with low shutter counts. I do not shoot a lot of high ISO stuff because to be honest, regardless of the camera, the resulting quality is generally below what I consider acceptable.
 

Samo

Senior Member
I have looked at them but to be honest for the kind of work I do I do not see enough of a difference to change. And it does come up short on the top end of shutter speeds and Nikon does not offer a battery grip for it. I will not spend that kind of money and put an inexpensive third party grip on it. If I am going to one day upgrade the D700 it most likely be with a D3X. There are still a lot of them out there with low shutter counts. I do not shoot a lot of high ISO stuff because to be honest, regardless of the camera, the resulting quality is generally below what I consider acceptable.

I am much the same as you. The dials were what did it for me. Well that and living with the sensor for a month or so. Then I was hooked big time. Being able to get great skin tones at 5000 was a huge surprise even though I rarely shoot past 1600. I am such a hold over from the film days. I am trying but I just keep getting older and more fossil like though. LOL :)

OP I am sorry for derailing your thread.
 

STM

Senior Member
I am much the same as you. The dials were what did it for me. Well that and living with the sensor for a month or so. Then I was hooked big time. Being able to get great skin tones at 5000 was a huge surprise even though I rarely shoot past 1600. I am such a hold over from the film days. I am trying but I just keep getting older and more fossil like though. LOL :)

OP I am sorry for derailing your thread.

I have to be totally honest with you, if someone could figure out how to put a 24MP FX sensor to fit on the back of my F2S or F4E I would get rid of all of my digital cameras.
 

Samo

Senior Member
I have to be totally honest with you, if someone could figure out how to put a 24MP FX sensor to fit on the back of my F2S or F4E I would get rid of all of my digital cameras.

I am with you on that. My final purchase after buying that back would be a Titan to go with it.
 

STM

Senior Member
I am with you on that. My final purchase after buying that back would be a Titan to go with it.

I love my F4E. It is one of the most comfortable and well balanced cameras I have ever held. I love my F2 but the ergonomics are not nearly as refined as the F4.
 

carguy

Senior Member
After pondering about the feature mix that Nikon decided on the D7500, I have made two conclusions. First, the dropping the AI-indexing tab, battery grip and and the second card slot seems to mean that there will be a successor to the D500. There needs to be one DX body fitted with all the features the public sees as "pro".

And since the D7500 is getting closer to the D5600 with the removal of the above features, and with the added tilt screen, I severely doubt whether the D5600 will have a successor. Sure, Nikon could name the next in line D3000-series camera D5700 no problem, but its feature set will be that of the D3000-series. They did the same thing with D600-series when they decided to name the D620 into D750 instead.

So the Nikon camera lineup is now D5, D810, D750, D500, D7500 and D3400. Three FX and three DX. All the other models are discontinued, but unfortunately for Nikon, thousands upon thousands of them lie in warehouses unsold. I think the Df was a one-off thing which is also discontinued long ago.

Nikon manufactures cameras in batches and we can be assured they will not re-tool their assembly lines to make another run of D7100 or D7200 despite those being still in price lists. Nikon has too much of those, no need to make any more.
Wait, so the D7100/D7200 nikon grip does not work on the D7500? Nikon has no electrical contact for a grip on the D7500?


No AI coupling to use older glass on the D7500 like every other modern Nikon DSLR?


Single card slot?


Looking closer, the neck strap mounts look like my D40?


It appears more like Nikon is neutering the prosumer DX cameras to push more to the D500 for sure.
 

pforsell

Senior Member
Wait, so the D7100/D7200 nikon grip does not work on the D7500? Nikon has no electrical contact for a grip on the D7500?


No AI coupling to use older glass on the D7500 like every other modern Nikon DSLR?


Single card slot?


Looking closer, the neck strap mounts look like my D40?


It appears more like Nikon is neutering the prosumer DX cameras to push more to the D500 for sure.


Nikon needs to reshuffle the product lines, doing business as usual is not an option since their bottom line is bleeding red. I doubt whether they can sustain 4 levels of DX cameras, and my guess is either 3 or 5 series will be slashed or merged into one. The whole DX line has moved up a bit, from D7200/D5500/D3300 to D500/D7500/D5600 and then maybe drop the D3400.

The AI indexing tab was only in the top DX body after Nikon introduced the first FX camera. D200 and D300 had it. D80 and D90 didn't. Then D7000-D7200 were the top DX model and had it, while 5-series and 3-series didn't. Now D500 has it and D7500 doesn't.
 

pforsell

Senior Member
Thom Hogan wrote a concise chronological history of the D70 to D7500 camera line. Looking at the table he created the progression is clear and makes sense.

Nikon Introduces the D7500 DSLR | DSLRBodies | Thom Hogan

The D7000 to D7200 cameras offered a little over their pay grade since there was no "D400" and the D7xxx series had to stand in for the missing top model. Now that the top spot is occupied by D500 the D7xxx series needs to stand back a little. All in all the D7500 looks like a fine camera -- on paper -- let's hope the manufacturing goes without hitches and quality control issues.
 

southaussieoutdoors

Senior Member
Thom Hogan wrote a concise chronological history of the D70 to D7500 camera line. Looking at the table he created the progression is clear and makes sense.

Nikon Introduces the D7500 DSLR | DSLRBodies | Thom Hogan

The D7000 to D7200 cameras offered a little over their pay grade since there was no "D400" and the D7xxx series had to stand in for the missing top model. Now that the top spot is occupied by D500 the D7xxx series needs to stand back a little. All in all the D7500 looks like a fine camera -- on paper -- let's hope the manufacturing goes without hitches and quality control issues.

Thanks for the link....makes sense.
 

Blacktop

Senior Member
Thom Hogan wrote a concise chronological history of the D70 to D7500 camera line. Looking at the table he created the progression is clear and makes sense.

Nikon Introduces the D7500 DSLR | DSLRBodies | Thom Hogan

The D7000 to D7200 cameras offered a little over their pay grade since there was no "D400" and the D7xxx series had to stand in for the missing top model. Now that the top spot is occupied by D500 the D7xxx series needs to stand back a little. All in all the D7500 looks like a fine camera -- on paper -- let's hope the manufacturing goes without hitches and quality control issues.

We get the D500's 20mp sensor,

.
Why do most reviews refer to the D500 sensor as 20mp? It's 20.9 which is basically a 21 mp sensor. :indecisiveness:
 

Elliot87

Senior Member
I was initially caught up in a lot of the negative hype surrounding the D7500, "only one SD card slot", "No battery grip!?" "won't meter with AI lenses" etc. I was a little disappointed as in some ways it is a lesser camera than my D7100 and so in my mind I ruled it out as an upgrade right away. But then I thought to myself, I have no battery grip and don't intend to get one, I virtually always use the second card as overflow so having to swap cards would be an infrequent minor inconvenience and I only have one AI lens which will still take great pictures, just a little more thought about exposure on my part.

The pluses this camera has over the D7100, which is somewhat crippled as a wildlife action camera by its buffer, far outweigh those negatives for me and the way I shoot. If the sensor is as good as it is reported to be, the improved iso capability, faster shutter and bigger buffer would make it a worthwhile step up for me. If the D500 didn't exist the D7500 would be on my shopping list. However knowing that the D500 is out there makes me doubt if I'll ever even lay hands on a D7500.

That is why this point makes perfect sense to me
The D7000 to D7200 cameras offered a little over their pay grade since there was no "D400" and the D7xxx series had to stand in for the missing top model. Now that the top spot is occupied by D500 the D7xxx series needs to stand back a little.
If the D7500 possessed all the features of the D7200, along with the other improvements it will possess, I would find it a lot harder to justify spending the extra money on a D500.

If Nikons new line up is D3400, D7500 & D500 I can see the sense in that.
 
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