Why should i buy a Nikon Flash over 3rd party ones? wich one do you like the most?

Alansin

Senior Member
Hi, im a guy who think is better to buy the "semi-pro" stuff early on, rather than buy a begginers one, then sell it or keep it, save more and buy the mid level one. i skip the entry level and go straight to the mid level, or high level if possible or if its worth it.

So, im looking at flashes, and im reading and viewing reviews about everything i can find.

I found that the yongun are "cheaper", and more and less "complicated on the menus"
I found that the "rocks flash" or something like that, can do everything that the nikons do, but also have Radio Triggers.
I found that nikon CLS and TTL flash get exposure correct every time, even in "burst mode".

I know money its always a thing to settle on a product you are going to buy, but thinking for a moment that money isnt that "important" (of course it is)
Why would you buy nikon flashes? or what is the best flash for the money? or what flashes do you recommend?

Note: i dont want a light sistem, or a lamp, i want a External/onboard Flash like those mentoned above, not studio lighting, FLASHES )
 

Horoscope Fish

Senior Member
I own both a Yongnuo 565EX and, more recently, I had an opportunity to acquire a Nikon SB-700, NIB, for next to nothing so I figured, why not?.

The Yongnuo costs about a third of what the SB-700 would. In practice, I can't tell the difference between the two. Both are very well built, recycle quickly and handle everything I thrown at them. I think what it comes down to, more often than not, is the feature set (does it handle HSS, for instance, will it work with Nikon's CLS, etc.) and "pride of ownership"; some people just FEEL better when it's Nikon branded. If warranties are a consideration for you, that might be something you want to consider. I don't really the details between the two so you'd have to research that yourself.

There's an excellent review of the Yongnuo 565EX here you might want to read over.

....
 
Last edited:

YourFearlessLeader

Senior Member
I was in a similar situation debating between the SB700 and the YN568. I purchased the YN for 1/3 the price of the Nikon, and honestly, in real working conditions I can not see any noticeable difference. I have a D7100 which has commander mode, so this can act off the camera wirelessly and has ittl. Perfect for my needs.
 

Bill16

Senior Member
I bought my nikon Sb-800 because they have a very good rep for durability and reliability. I didn't want to take the chance on a different brand that hasn't been out long enough to have a rep for durability, when I bought my flash. I'm still not sure the Yongnuo has been out long enough to rate for durability, but they seem to get good ratings for working well at a cheap price.
But I'm not really knowledgeable on flashes, so my reasoning might not be what your looking for. :)
 

fotojack

Senior Member
I used to have the SB-700 flash. Great flash. Nothing wrong with it at all. I still recommend it to anyone who "must" have nothing but Nikon brand gear. Having said that, I sold the SB-700 and got myself the Yongnuo YN565EX (comparable to the SB-800). Then I went and got the YN560 III, and just recently picked up the YN560 IV and the YN560-TX to control them all. All those 4 Yongnuo's cost me less than one SB-700. And they work beautifully! There's a reason they sell so many......because they really do work! And they're well built, too.

But hey...some people like spending money on "brand name" stuff. Who am I to argue? ;)
 

SteveL54

Senior Member
No doubt the 565EX is a bargain, but I had a lemon. It quit after 200 flashes, and and correspondence with Yungno was a nightmare. I won't get into all the details, as it has been beat to death in another post somewhere here. Long story even longer, I took the $$ that Amazon refunded me and bought the SB700. Others have had nothing but success with theirs, and mine worked great (when it worked) Clearly you can't beat it for the $$, but I'll stick with Nikon.
 

rocketman122

Senior Member
I have the 568 and 565. Ive used them as on camera flahses and they arent as accurate as nikons for ttl.

I know that the power is controlled byt the camera to tell it when to close but IMO there is some nikon circuitry that does it much better. just like sigma back engineer AF to work with nikon cameras, I believe anything 3rd party is done this way as well. nikons flashes are way more accurate. there is some proprietary software/circuitry working that makes it better. I have no doubt.

I was considering the phottix mitros but read that the flash tends to overexpose and even in a firmware they released, one was to fix the overexposure. so I think it confimrs that it is true and they adjust it as they need. there is something in the nikon flashes that the others dont have and its the reason I solely use them as on camera flashes. especially in ittl. with 622n slave or not.

I did have an event where there was something extremely weird happening and none of my flashes were working properly for some reason. I used the 568 and I was adjusting power at least 50% of the time.

off camera, the yongnuo ARE KINGS! theyre fast powerful inexpensive and are well made. they sell like crazy. pros here use tons of them. many use them on light stands and many get toppled over from guests bumping into them. either it works or if it doesnt you buy another. simple as that for $70. their slaves are excellent as well.

biggest problem with the Sb700 is its isnt that strong. its fast to recycle but in bounce mode it just cant pump out enough light. Im trying to modify a rogue flash bender clone I bought on ebay to make a bigger bounce card that will push more light forward instead of up. its too huge and cumbersome to use as it is.

Im now keeping my eyes on shanny flashes because they look like they got some killer stuff working and are competitive with yongnuo. they look killer. im waiitng for the flasgship nikon to be released around april.

SHANNY – Flash & Trigger Models | FLASH HAVOC
 
Last edited:

rocketman122

Senior Member
Hi, im a guy who think is better to buy the "semi-pro" stuff early on, rather than buy a begginers one, then sell it or keep it, save more and buy the mid level one. i skip the entry level and go straight to the mid level, or high level if possible or if its worth it.

So, im looking at flashes, and im reading and viewing reviews about everything i can find.

I found that the yongun are "cheaper", and more and less "complicated on the menus"
I found that the "rocks flash" or something like that, can do everything that the nikons do, but also have Radio Triggers.
I found that nikon CLS and TTL flash get exposure correct every time, even in "burst mode".

I know money its always a thing to settle on a product you are going to buy, but thinking for a moment that money isnt that "important" (of course it is)
Why would you buy nikon flashes? or what is the best flash for the money? or what flashes do you recommend?

Note: i dont want a light sistem, or a lamp, i want a External/onboard Flash like those mentoned above, not studio lighting, FLASHES )



the yongnuo are very simple. they have some customs settings like sleep and beep and quick on/off etc. but not a heavy menu system like nikons. I think CLS is crap but I guess if you have a closed indoor home shoot then it will be fine. I dont see any reason not to use radio slaves today. the 603II are reliable inexpensive and work well with the 560III/IV

speedlights are the way to go today IMO. I sold my 1200W/S studio flashes and never looked back. I never shot a portrait session need more than one. if one needs more power you can simply mount two on a bracket but since I shoot at 5.6 the most a speedlight will do even more than that.
 

Whiskeyman

Senior Member
I've used third-party flashes in the past, and the only ones that I'd buy again are from Metz. I've also owned several Nikon flashes over the years, and the only drawback to them that I've experienced is that they get "lifted" if you give it a chance. I currently own a SB-700 that I purchased after my last SB-600 was stolen. I purchased the -700 because they don't make the -600 any more. If they were available, I would have purchased the -600 again. Now I've found a local source for used SB-600s, and they cost as much used as they did when I bought my first new one. I may buy one before the supply dries up, but I'm really more interested in other purchases now.

That said, I've not used Yongnuo flashes at all, so they might be a brand that I'd go back to if I'd used them before. Based upon the price and the strong testimonies from some members of nicotine, I'd be willing to give them a try. Based upon some other reviews, I'd explore Cowboy Studio products, as well.

WM
 

WayneF

Senior Member
I've used third-party flashes in the past, and the only ones that I'd buy again are from Metz.

Metz was very good, they have made flashes longer than Nikon. But this news surely affects the future:
German TV maker Metz files for insolvency | Reuters

Flash is a little difficult, especially TTL. There are so many factors affecting it. Inverse square law is a biggie, not affecting the sunlight we see here. There are also additional camera controls for it. Beginners just see that the flash can be a little off, and without understanding, they blame the wrong reasons.

The TTL flash just does what the camera metering dictates, hopefully correctly, but for the most part, it just flashes.

This Yongnuo review is written to compare directly to the SB-800, but primarily for the purpose of a bit of explanation about whys both misbehave at times.
Review of the Yongnuo YN565EX Speedlight

And Flash Indoors covers more whys.

And Nikon TTL BL flash - D-lens distance data accuracy covers TTL BL direct flash with zooms, a special case. Beginners unfortunately assume point&shoot flash ought to "just work", and they do tend to use TTL BL direct flash (SB-800 or YN565EX, default for the Nikon system, so also the camera internal flash). So this seems to me be a really big deal, yet all others are quiet about it ???
 

Bill16

Senior Member
Well since your the one, buddy, that convinced me to go for Nikon flashes, I guess that means Yongnuo must be great! Lol ;)
Well I guess I'll have to try one out too! Lol :)


I used to have the SB-700 flash. Great flash. Nothing wrong with it at all. I still recommend it to anyone who "must" have nothing but Nikon brand gear. Having said that, I sold the SB-700 and got myself the Yongnuo YN565EX (comparable to the SB-800). Then I went and got the YN560 III, and just recently picked up the YN560 IV and the YN560-TX to control them all. All those 4 Yongnuo's cost me less than one SB-700. And they work beautifully! There's a reason they sell so many......because they really do work! And they're well built, too.

But hey...some people like spending money on "brand name" stuff. Who am I to argue? ;)
 
Last edited:

WayneF

Senior Member
China is surely going to change things in a big way. They are putting out some good stuff now, unimaginably cheap.

A $17 Neewer CY-20, very minimal, but fully comparable to a $147 Nikon SB-300, except it can work standalone, off camera (SB-300 cannot).

EDIT: OOPS. Sorry, got carried away, I think the CY-20 is NOT TTL. Should have pointed to the $44 Neewer VK320.


A $65 Neewer NW985N, has high power and full features, iTTL, including HSS, comparable to a $327 SB-700 (but more power and zoom).

And of course the Yongnuo...

Some of the little features are still missing, but the $300+ equivalents (and $500+ equivalents) can only suffer.
 
Last edited:

SkvLTD

Senior Member
Now, I still haven't looked through my YN568EX's settings (not that there are many), but it consistently misses exposure in TLL and screws up the camera's metering as well. So shooting with TTL and auto-ISO produces spastic results. Works just fine in manual, manual wireless, HSS, but TTL really lags. Also with the flash in manual, it doesn't communicate appropriate ISO to the camera whatsoever.

I don't remember such a huge issue with the 565, and definitely non-existent in SB910.

My point is this though - if you want the flash to help both you and the camera in fast-paced situations, when TTL makes things much easier, brand names or very select 3rd party models come to the rescue. It may just be my 568, but it's very odd that this is the ONLY feature that lags tremendously.
 

Alansin

Senior Member
Now, I still haven't looked through my YN568EX's settings (not that there are many), but it consistently misses exposure in TLL and screws up the camera's metering as well. So shooting with TTL and auto-ISO produces spastic results. Works just fine in manual, manual wireless, HSS, but TTL really lags. Also with the flash in manual, it doesn't communicate appropriate ISO to the camera whatsoever.

I don't remember such a huge issue with the 565, and definitely non-existent in SB910.

My point is this though - if you want the flash to help both you and the camera in fast-paced situations, when TTL makes things much easier, brand names or very select 3rd party models come to the rescue. It may just be my 568, but it's very odd that this is the ONLY feature that lags tremendously.


And do you think its maybe your settings of lack of them on the flash/camera?
or its def. the flash?

its interesting because 568 is the "newer" for the nikon...
 

SkvLTD

Senior Member
And do you think its maybe your settings of lack of them on the flash/camera?
or its def. the flash?

its interesting because 568 is the "newer" for the nikon...

Idea behind regular TTL is that flash reads camera's meter/ISO, set itself to exposure accordingly and communicates to the camera to make sure, right? That chain seems to be either weak or missing a link every time so it gets underexposed all the time and the camera does not set the correct ISO in turn to help the flash.

I've been using it in manual mode in controlled environments just fine.
 

WayneF

Senior Member
Idea behind regular TTL is that flash reads camera's meter/ISO, set itself to exposure accordingly and communicates to the camera to make sure, right? That chain seems to be either weak or missing a link every time so it gets underexposed all the time and the camera does not set the correct ISO in turn to help the flash.


The TTL flash itself really does not play a part in determining exposure. Instead, the camera meter is in control, and it sets a power level in the flash. Not an absolute level (flash model and capability is unknown), but camera meters a TTL preflash, and then requests more stops of power to be the final exposure. The flash merely complies, assuming it has enough power to do it.

Auto ISO does not work (stays at Minimum) if a Manual mode flash is detected, or if Commander is used.

For many Nikon camera models, Auto ISO only meters for the ambient, so the poor flash picture is always working into a high ISO environment (dim places where we use flash).

There are exceptions though, three big variations.

1. The older cameras (Until the D300S, 2009) always stayed at Minimum ISO if flash was detected in use (simply because, we are using flash instead). It was possible that Auto ISO could increase, but only in situations when the maximum flash power was not sufficient. That is a vague ballpark, flash model and capability was not known.

2. Then the D300S until just before the D800 always simply metered the ambient for Auto ISO, without regard for the flash. The TTL BL flash became just fill flash (into an orange incandescent setting - Nikon added filters for the flash). It seems a good plan to turn Auto ISO off for flash in these models.

3. Then the last few models, from D800 and after (2012), realized the error, and now the last few models limit Auto ISO to only a two stop increase if flash is detected present (two stops of ISO is about right for bounce flash).

Auto ISO of course tries to make the ambient exposure right without a flash. It is about ambient.

You can easily see which Auto ISO version your camera uses.
Indoors (some dim situation), with flash turned off, take a camera meter reading of the scene, and check the ISO. Auto ISO will of course be high
Then reach up and turn the flash on, and take another reading. Unless camera M mode or Rear Curtain sync, this probably increases shutter speed to 1/60 (additional demands on ISO).

The three cases will be:

1. Minimum ISO (ignores Auto ISO) - Older models, D300 and older. We're using flash instead, and don't need/want maximum ISO.
2. ISO stays high - D300S and after. Auto ISO is NOT about the flash. Auto ISO is instead of the flash.
3. ISO limited to two stops (4x ISO) above minimum. Perhaps less in brighter scenes. - Last few new models, since D800. Flash is taken into account.
 
Last edited:
Top