High ISO noise - pleasantly surprised

Coming from the D70 and then D300s cameras I've historically viewed anything above ISO 1600 ans something only suitable for the brave. When I got the D800 and D7100 bodies I started to realise that the sensor technology had moved along such that 6400 was very useable, certainly on the D800, with the D7100 not being a huge way behind. Have made this discovery I was no longer concerned about setting my auto ISO at 3200 or 6400 safe in the knowledge that it was better than pulling it back in Lightroom. This morning I was thinking about this and tried some 12800 and 25600 shots (I've just never bothered before) with the D800 and I must say I was pleasantly surprised by the results. The shots were not taken in near darkness, just my living room with no lights on. In taking the shots I did the following:

** Use raw.

1. Exposed the picture properly in the first place. I think people have a tendency to use a higher than normal ISO but then under expose to avoid going even higher. I think you are better going higher on the ISO, however I know some articles suggest this is just a light amp anyway.
2. Imported to Lightroom as a raw and adjusted any of the basic settings required and removed any sharpening.
3. Loaded Photoshop and ran Nik define. It does a good job at default.
4. Resized the image to 3000 pixels on the long side. My logic being that this is still a high quality 10" print resolution. This reduction loses noise and makes things look sharper.
5. Ran pro contrast from Nik Colour efex. I'm doing this on everything now.
6. Run the Nik output sharpener.

I also added some vibrance as the high ISO images do not have the colour depth or dynamic range of the low ISO files.

Prior to processing the images didn't look too great, but afterwards I was pleased.

This is not going to be my default setting moving forward, but if I need shutter speed in low light, something that VR can't fix, this has given me some confidence.

Note that this is more of a modern sensor thread rather than a D800 promotion, although this camera does it quite well.

I think we worry far too much about noise and not enough about the photograph. Noise has never ruined a truly great photo, it just provides a further distraction on the so-so ones.

That said, you're spot on about the advances in sensor technology. Heck, was it Sony that just announced a camera that can shoot in the dark? When I'm out and about I almost never worry about ISO any more. Both the D800 and D600 are set on Auto ISO with a top end of 6400 as the norm. I'd rather just have to worry about the photo. Set the shutter speed to stop the bird and the aperture to get the DoF I want and let the camera do the rest. Heck, as long as I pay some attention I can shoot Manual like it's Auto, which is great for birds in flight. Set the shutter to 1/1000 - 1/1600 sec and the aperture around f/8 on the big lens (sweet spot) and if I'm in the mid-thousands with the ISO who cares? Better than no noise and a blurred bird.

One question, Geoff. When you say you "removed all sharpening" does that mean that you moved the slider to 0 in LR? Honestly, I've never thought to do that and will usually leave it at the default (which I've always assumed gets set by the camera), but it makes perfect sense. I just looked at a 3:1 zoom of a 1400 ISO shot in LR and sure enough, less noise. Thanks for enlightening me on a rainy Tuesday morning (which sounds more humble than me thanking you for making me feel like a dumbass - LOL). It's true, if we pay attention we're always learning something.

It sounds like we use a similar technique in setting aperture and shutter and letting the ISO sort the rest. I will probably stick with 6400 as my top default unless I'm in a particular situation that warrants higher.

Yes, when I say remove the sharpening I mean set the slider to zero. If you import a jpg it doesn't apply sharpening by default (Makes sense), but applies 25 for raw (Perhaps also makes sense). I should probably change the preset as I always end up reducing it to zero before processing. My logic is that I don't want to remove noise or sharpen an image that has already been sharpened.

The other thing I've started doing is reducing the image size in Photoshop using that smart object technique that I mentioned previously. Apart from the speed and file size benefits it makes the images look better. If you start pixel peeping on a D800 image at full resolution it needs to be pretty good not to show any flaws. If I reduce the long edge to 3000 pixels for printing or 1600 for web it looks much sharper and less noisy. You can only do this in Lightroom by exporting and I like to view and sort from there.

Jake, you have made my day anyway. It's lovely and sunny here in Manchester UK and it's not often we have the advantage there. Manchester is one of the wettest places in the UK!!

I too rely on auto ISO with my cameras. The entire system which includes the metering does a great job in getting the right exposure. Nothing much to add since I have experienced this already. The RAW files are just exceptional when it comes to manipulating the shadows and the right exposure.

I think I am on Mars. I use to think Plus X was fast at ASA 125. Panatomic X was ASA 32. I tried to stay away from Tri-X with an ASA of 400 because it was grainey. I loved Kodachrome II at ASA 25. Yall have no idea how good you have it.

Thanks for the tip. I will try it shooting wildlife.

There is a book called "Prairie Wings" by Ed Queeny. You can find it on eBay. If is a must if you like birds in flight. It was first published in 1947. My family once owned the property where most of the photography was done.

Beam me up Scotty!!!

Yall have a great day.

Roger

I too rely on Auto ISO on my D800, but I set my max ISO to 3200. So far so good. Haven't tried moving it up to 6400, nor even tried shooting at 6400. I did shoot some 3200 shots in the Grand Canyon at last light back in Jan, and they had more noise than I would've preferred to deal with. From your experience, does 6400 still yield acceptable quality that's salvageable in post?

T-Man said:

I too rely on Auto ISO on my D800, but I set my max ISO to 3200. So far so good. Haven't tried moving it up to 6400, nor even tried shooting at 6400. I did shoot some 3200 shots in the Grand Canyon at last light back in Jan, and they had more noise than I would've preferred to deal with. From your experience, does 6400 still yield acceptable quality that's salvageable in post?

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6400 is acceptable to me, especially if I'm down sampling the image. I use nik define to sort the noise and I think it's important not to under expose. You may have a different view of acceptable. Why not try it?


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6400 works for me as well!

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25600 ISO, 75watt wolfram light bulb on the ceiling, out of camera jpg, handheld, 80-200mm f/4.5-5.6 G@200mm...

Well had a play using your instructions,i think i could have made a better job of the pro contrst part but its promising i think

6400 iso

Strange that looked a lot better before i uploaded it

mikew said:

Well had a play using your instructions,i think i could have made a better job of the pro contrst part but its promising i think

6400 iso

Click to expand...

Camera noise will be more visible when pixel peeping shadows inside your place.

mikew said:

Strange that looked a lot better before i uploaded it

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They usually do. I compare the shots I upload here, then the same shot that is uploaded to Flickr and it's night and day.

To Flickr you upload them at their full resolution, I think... I found about that when I had to download them (being in a need to use them when I was away from my comp)...

DraganDL said:

To Flickr you upload them at their full resolution, I think... I found about that when I had to download them (being in a need to use them when I was away from my comp)...

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You don't have to upload them at full rez, but that is the default I think.