Photoshop CS6 or Elements

WhiteLight

Senior Member
Hi everyone

Looking for some advice from folks who know or have used these programs.
A few of you here have tickled my need to step beyond LR.
i have been wanting to learn Photoshop for a while now, but have had no luck with 'free time'.

My question is this - Do you think it would be better off learning Elements as it handles most of what PS can do or just go straight to PS?
Eventually i would probably learn both, but i need a starting point.
I know PS is way more expensive, though atm i am looking more at the learning aspect than the cost factor.
 

crycocyon

Senior Member
I think if you want to eventually use Photoshop then I would start with learning on that. There is just so much more you can do with it (like the Brenizer Method). That way you put the money you save from purchasing Elements towards the cost of Photoshop.
 
PhotoShop is the software to learn if you can afford it. I started off with Photoshop but have tried both LR and Elements to see what all the fuss was about but have always gone back to PS. I will not leave home without it.

At the level you are shooting you owe it to yourself to learn PS
 

Dave_W

The Dude
Photoshop is awesome but not something you can jump into running. It's as powerful as it is complex but once you get a basic understanding of how PS treats images the more complex issues of the program start to make more sense.

So if you're the type of person who enjoys a challenge and you don't mind a little hard work in the beginning then go for it.
 

LouCioccio

Senior Member
What Elements does not have: CMYK, smart objects, channels,,more transforming of an object and real actions.
Plugins will work. As long as you can master layers use masks WITHOUT destroying a pixel you will be fine.


​Lou Cioccio
 
What Elements does not have: CMYK, smart objects, channels,,more transforming of an object and real actions.
Plugins will work. As long as you can master layers use masks WITHOUT destroying a pixel you will be fine.


​Lou Cioccio

I may be wrong but I think PS is the only one that has Content Aware Fill also. That one is worth the cost of PS once you learn it.
 

WhiteLight

Senior Member
Thanks guys..
That was a surprising response cos most of the material online suggests that Elements can do most of what PS can (Don - Elements 11 does have content aware fill).
And specially for photographers Elements would be the best choice as it leaves out most of what we don't need...

What Elements does not have: CMYK, smart objects, channels,,more transforming of an object and real actions.
Plugins will work. As long as you can master layers use masks WITHOUT destroying a pixel you will be fine.

am afraid i really don't know what any of those mean yet :p
guessing that would be important in our work flow?
 

LouCioccio

Senior Member
Yes I forgot Elements does have content aware its the second tool with the crop tool in Elements ten. Use the green to keep and red what you do not want and then slide. Pretty slick.
If Whitelight sees this you can download a 30 day trial for either Elements or CS6 to see which one you like. I am not happy with Adobe structure in upgrades and it seems to go more for rental and the cloud.
I have CS5e and really use layers, masks and smart objects and never saw the need for Lightroom for what I can do in PS. I teach Elements but I hand out erasures (from the black/green board) and let people know if I go to fast to throw it at me; I will slow down and explain. Also they (the participants) are allowed to yell out when I draw a blank on which pull down to use as I hardly use Elements for my own work. At least the hot keys work.

Ciao,
​Lou Cioccio
 

Dave_W

The Dude
Thanks guys..
That was a surprising response cos most of the material online suggests that Elements can do most of what PS can (Don - Elements 11 does have content aware fill).
And specially for photographers Elements would be the best choice as it leaves out most of what we don't need...

You know what, I've read and heard that statement, too, and I used to believe that. But the more I learn PS the more I see the power of PS demonstrated in the tutorials I've been following the less I believe that's true. I think if anything Elements is designed for people not willing to take the time and put in the effort to learn PS, so they water down a lot of the portions utilizing layers and masks and as a result you're only tapping into a small section of what PS has to offer.

​And it may also be true also that when they say "More for photographers" they're meaning the dad who's taking pictures of his kids or the grandmother who is scanning in old photos, not the type of people who spend days thinking about how to photograph a certain subject and then once captured spend hours pouring over the exact tweaks to give it that right punch. So I think we may be getting a little lost on the term "photographers" and indeed, elements may be more for photographers but maybe not the kind of photographers you and I are.....or not. ;)
 

Ruidoso Bill

Senior Member
I have never heard anything about elements other than folks referring to it as Photoshop lite. If it was as powerful every pro would be using it to save time, something we are all looking for more of. My advice is to learn Photoshop and not spend your money on something that will not meet all your future needs.
 

Horoscope Fish

Senior Member
I may be wrong but I think PS is the only one that has Content Aware Fill also.
You are correct; Content Aware Fill is new to, I think, Photoshop CS 6. And it's amazing.

That one is worth the cost of PS once you learn it.
Content Aware Fill is nothing short of amaaazing. Have I mentioned how amazing it is?

And while Photoshop *is* astoundingly powerful I'm also convinced anyone willing to read couple free tutorials on sites like photoshopessentials.com (a personal favorite (Steve Patterson is my hero!)), or shell out a few bucks for the incredible Lynda.com (ridiculously cheap for what you get), can start working on basic, global corrections on photographs (e.g. exposure and color balance, sharpening) within an hour. From there you learn some of the selection tools so you can refine what you're working on and next thing you know, BAM! You're off and running.
 

Happypuppy

Senior Member
I learned Photoshop years ago when it first came out. I used it a lot and its an amazing tool. Time went by and products like Elements at about v4 came out with a lot of power. Later we had Lightroom. The only thing I was using PS for was RAW files. A couple years ago that even stopped as there is nothing I can't do in Lightroom and Elements. Some may have specific needs but for myself its over kill.

What would I do if I was starting out today? Photoshop. Everything you learn will work with Elements and in most cases Lightroom. The resources to learn it are readily available and very good.
 
You are correct; Content Aware Fill is new to, I think, Photoshop CS 6. And it's amazing.


Content Aware Fill is nothing short of amaaazing. Have I mentioned how amazing it is?

And while Photoshop *is* astoundingly powerful I'm also convinced anyone willing to read couple free tutorials on sites like photoshopessentials.com (a personal favorite (Steve Patterson is my hero!)), or shell out a few bucks for the incredible Lynda.com (ridiculously cheap for what you get), can start working on basic, global corrections on photographs (e.g. exposure and color balance, sharpening) within an hour. From there you learn some of the selection tools so you can refine what you're working on and next thing you know, BAM! You're off and running.

Content aware fill in is CS5 That is the version I have.
 

BackdoorArts

Senior Member
A lot of great advice. Let me put it to you simply. If you're only considering Elements because it will serve as a gateway into learning Photoshop, then just bite the bullet, spend the money and go CS6. Huge learning curve? Absolutely. But, if you've used Lightroom, the interface is similar enough that now all you need to learn are the tools. Seriously. There are tons of great free tutorials out there, some from Adobe, some elsewhere. You can either pick and choose through them, or bite the bullet and pay for some. The fact is, the difference between a great photo you've taken and that great photo you keep staring at on 500px.com and wondering, ""Why can't I get mine to look like that?", is that the person on 500px knows knows how to use Photoshop to take advantage of every photo.

You can get some of the way there with Elements and other plugins, but not all the way. I tried and thought I was succeeding. But as I sat for 6 hours and listened to Scott Kelby talk about Photography and watched some of the little things he turned to Photoshop for, I could see that it was those little things that made a difference. So I bit the bullet and joined NAPP (photoshopuser.com) and after about 10 hours of video and one monthly magazine I'm already impressing the heck out of myself with what I can do to photos I took 2 years ago that I knew were good, but I just couldn't make them pop the way I wanted them to - needed them to. And there's still a million things I don't know yet. And then there's the things I never would have thought about. Like taking the photo below that I posted in this post and where I added some realistic DoF bokeh ... in under a minute. I would have struggled with that for far too long and come up short without seeing someone else do it first.

I'm not trying to sell you on any one set of instruction, only saying that the jump to Photoshop is like college. Sure, you can learn the stuff they teach there on your own, but there are systems of learning it that work and instead of hunting and pecking through YouTube get access to a comprehensive set of videos and go through them. NAPP is $99 for a year, and it gets you a year of Photoshop User magazine plus access to their training site while contains complete walkthroughs of both CS6 and LR4, and this set of additional detailed courses. Use that to compare to other sites.

And the difference in interfaces between PS and Elements is starting to become greater. Elements 9 was fairly close to CS5, but Elements 11, while a better tool than 9, is very different from CS6 in terms of where you go to set certain tool parameters. It's the best Elements I've used in terms of what you can do with an image (it has content aware healing brush, but not fill), but it's not Photoshop.
 

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WhiteLight

Senior Member
Thanks Jake... i think PS has overwhelmingly won everyone over around here..
I very seriously have considered NAPP even before i started with LR, but was quite turned off by the fact that International customers need to pay $199 as opposed to the regular $99.
I do not think shipping the magazines would cost the additional $100...
 
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